"Bondage" -- February 20, 2022

[08:10] Vanni Cannoli: OK let's go ahead and get started

[08:10] Lngo Delvalle: woot woot

[08:11] Vanni Cannoli: Before I open the discussion, let me post the usual header:  Our discussions are in text and are in the usual C/Q/R format, meaning type "C" if you wish to make a comment, "Q" if you have a question, usually directed at a person's comments, and "R" if you wish to retract either your C or your Q.  If a person has a question for a specific person on what they said, just say "Q @ [name]"

[08:11] Vanni Cannoli: We tend to go in the order received, however, we generally will promote questions directed at a person's comment to the top.

[08:11] Vanni Cannoli: If a person asks a question of the group, there is no need to put in a "C" to reply, replies to the question will be open.

[08:12] Vanni Cannoli: While we are a chatty group, lots of extra chat makes it "noisy," so if we can please keep that to a minimum, it would be very appreciated, thank Y/you!

[08:12] Vanni Cannoli: The blog for this munch is:  https://xaarakoffeeklatch.blogspot.com/   It holds the archive for our munches here starting Jan 3, 2021.

[08:13] Vanni Cannoli: Today we start our yearly look into the BDSM Acronym.  It's useful as it's the backbone of what we do here at Xaara, and we always get new people so we get new, fresh ideas into these topics

[08:14] Brianne: fresh dirty ideas, hopefully

[08:14] Vanni Cannoli: I expect that the discussion over these things will take eight to ten weeks.

[08:14] Vanni Cannoli: So today we start with Bondage.

[08:14] Vanni Cannoli: To quote Wikipedia, which knows all, Bondage "is the practice of consensually tying, binding, or restraining a partner for erotic, aesthetic, or somatosensory stimulation. A partner may be physically restrained in a variety of ways, including the use of rope, cuffs, bondage tape, or self-adhering bandage."

[08:15] Pure Delvalle: squirm on her cushion

[08:15] Vanni Cannoli: There are obviously many ways to accomplish this.

[08:16] Vanni Cannoli: But the effect is the immobilization of the person in some way

[08:16] Vanni Cannoli: Sometimes the bondage is mixed in a scene.  For example, tying a person down and spanking them, or using some toy, and doing S/M activities.

[08:16] Vanni Cannoli: Or electricity

[08:16] Vanni Cannoli: Or...whatever... *grins*

[08:17] Vanni Cannoli: Sometimes the bondage is the scene in and of itself.

[08:17] Vanni Cannoli: For example, suspension play.

[08:17] Vanni Cannoli: We have a lot of people into that at my First Life club, it's a thing of art to watch it done.

[08:18] Vanni Cannoli: It can take 45 minutes to an our to get all the rigging done.

[08:18] Vanni Cannoli: And then the person is hoisted in the air and displayed.

[08:18] Vanni Cannoli: Also, we have people who are into wrapping, using a kind of plastic wrap to mummify them

[08:19] Vanni Cannoli: Sometimes this is mixed with suspension, we have a winch will hoist the mummified person in the air.

[08:19] Vanni Cannoli: And then of course, there are people who just like being tied up and kneeling/laying at the Top or Dom/mes feet.

[08:20] Vanni Cannoli: Another form that is common is leashing.  It connects the Bottom/sub to the Top or Dom/me and keeps them from going anywhere.  *grins*

[08:21] Vanni Cannoli: Leashing of course also has connections to D/s and S/M that we will get to when we get to those topics.

[08:21] Vanni Cannoli: And yes, shibari is a very beautiful form of Bondage.

[08:21] Ḱιrιn StαrۣۣۜLιght Serevι: one of my favourites

[08:22] Vanni Cannoli: We have a nice shibari dojo here at Xaara that I would suggest Y/you visit if you have not...and are into it.

[08:22] Vanni Cannoli: So, now that we have an idea clearly in mind about what Bondage is, here are today's Discussion questions:

[08:23] Vanni Cannoli: 1) WHY do we like this so much?  What is the thrill/kink about being tied up, or tying someone up?  To vanillas this seems like madness.  Why do we like it so much (from both the Top or Dom/me AND Bottom/sub positions on this)

[08:24] Vanni Cannoli: and 2) can SL be a decent facsimile of doing this live?  We don't have the tactile response here we do in First Life, so is seeing an avatar tied the same thing, or a different thing, to do this with other persons?

[08:25] Vanni Cannoli: By the way, one last thing, this is how many vanilla folks start getting into the scene -- bedroom games that involve being tied/blindfolded during sex that leads to further interest... ;)

[08:25] Vanni Cannoli: Ok Master Ballard, we start with You please!

[08:26] Ballard: I wrestled her arms behind her back, and pressed my cock against her ass.  She squealed and said no, but her eager smile and flashing eyes told me not to even think of stopping.  This is a true story about one of my first RL bondage experiences.  A young lady from High School that read me a story of bondage and rape, then looked at me like I was a chocolate bar and asked me if I would come over to her house after school.  *sighs at the fond memory*

I have always linked bondage with sex.  Taking a woman and restraining her, perhaps a bit of whipping or other sensation play to get her wound up.  but for me, it all ends up with my hungry cock getting that pussy.  This explains why I enjoyed Gor, and also why I left it when that sort of play became no longer the ideal. 

1)  A beautiful, helpless perfect female body.  In my hands, to be petted, fucked, spanked...  What's not to like?

2) SL with good emoting is a superb facsimile of this.  It is the spirit and heart of the submissive that the emoting can express beautifully.

[08:27] Vanni Cannoli: I'm sure a lot of people agree with that sentiment, Master Ballard!

[08:28] Ballard: Bondage without sex, to mne, is like watching the first half of a  movie , and never seeing the end

[08:28] Vanni Cannoli: After all, as I mentioned, a lot of people first experience BDSM by tie up and sex games.  *glances at Rachel*  We have a very close friend here who was not sure about BDSM until she started doing that with her husband....now she's quite the BDSM tramp lol.  So I hear....

[08:30] Vanni Cannoli: Understood, Master.  But it seems for a good number of folks, the tie up has some mental reward in and of itself.

[08:30] Vanni Cannoli: Everyone has their thing! *grins*

[08:30] Ballard: yes of course

[08:30] Vanni Cannoli: Thank You Master Ballard, insightful as ever! :)

[08:31] Vanni Cannoli: Hestia, you are up please.

[08:31] Hestia Namaar: my bdsm test, indicated i was a rope bunny first and prey 2nd. Bondage has always excited me, but there is nothing in RL in that way, it is not an interest of my husband. so SL is it, but it does help fill that gap. with the use of RLV, bondage CAN be very..realistic. and the Leash. sigh..HOW..jealous i was of girls...whom were leashed....it almost ate away at me. But Now...Sir Davos, is always leashing me..and i feel connected when he does so. And on a side note...a leash is a useful thing when shopping. One party dragging another behind :) #

[08:32] Vanni Cannoli: it sounds like you have a new leash on life!

[08:32] Hestia Namaar: facepalms and laughs

[08:33] Vanni Cannoli: And yes, you are right Hestia, as the brain is the biggest sex organ, seeing something happen to our avatar does have strong mental and emotional reactions connected to it

[08:34] Vanni Cannoli: I am glad you found someone to help you with those desires, Hestia!

[08:34] Vanni Cannoli: Very good response, thank you!

[08:35] Vanni Cannoli: Ok, we go to Peaches, please!

[08:35] Peaches Svenska smiled at Vanni. "Thank you, love. After going through the Angel and Seraph programs, here in Xaara, I have come to understand myself significantly more than i did when i arrived here, a little over 2 yrs ago.

I am NOT a pain slut, but boy of boy, do i like bondage.

I was sexually abused as a child, as so many of us have been, and when i became an adult and discovered that I loved bondage and CNC, it made me wonder why.

In my Seraph studies and research, it hit me that when I am bound, or a 'victim' of CNC, I cannot be held responsible for the naughty things that 'happen' to me.

As a child and young adult, i suffered guilt over the fact that, in time, i came to enjoy the 'abuse'. 'Good girls must resist, must not enjoy such dirty things' rattled through my head all the time. So being bound, relieves me of that 'guilt' and 'shame' of being naughty..if that makes any sense."

Oh! and being leashed makes me feel safe, loved, and owned which makes me very happy.#

[08:36] Vanni Cannoli: That's very interesting and I can see how bondage has that psychological effect

[08:37] Vanni Cannoli: BDSM in all its aspects has the effect of taking choice from the Bottom or Sub or Slave and giving it to the Other.

[08:37] Vanni Cannoli: Which is a profound psychological effect as you note, Peaches

[08:38] Peaches Svenska nodded

[08:38] Vanni Cannoli: "I don't have to feel guilt, or shame, or anything because the other has power over me, my choices are theirs."

[08:38] Peaches Svenska: exactly

[08:38] Vanni Cannoli: But in a safe and healthy environment rather than abusive (in almost all cases anyway)

[08:39] Vanni Cannoli: I am SO glad you came to these realizations about yourself! ♥ *hugs*

[08:39] Peaches Svenska: ty love..me too

[08:39] Vanni Cannoli: :)

[08:39] Vanni Cannoli: BDSM is healing!   Those red marks are medical therapy!

[08:39] Vanni Cannoli: Thanks Peaches!

[08:40] Vanni Cannoli: Ok next we go to Brianne!  Take it, Blondie!

[08:40] Brianne: There are a million wonderful things to say about bondage, and it's the main draw for me into the BDSM world.  I really need a lot more First Life experience but what I can say so far is that even though it's voluntary, and I'm sorta used to it, there are still moments when I get that 'oh, no, what have I got myself into' feeling.  That's when I get the chance to dig deeper into submission and lean into trusting, and that is another reward on top of the pure carnal, sensual pleasure of being helpless and sexually tormented.  Who's with me?! .......

[08:40] Brianne: SL allows for some of the submissive sensations if not the physical ones.  I know that when Mistress ties me up, I'm at her mercy and that deepens our relationship.  She likes to half-joke that 'binding is caring'.  She's not wrong.  She knows that we we're indulging our mutual fetish for the enjoyment of ourself and the other.  It makes me smile just thinking of it.  It doesn't have to end with sex, sometimes the promise of more teasing to come is the best ending.  And I find myself actually craving the leash.  I love the sense of 'belonging'.  #

[08:41] Brianne: :)

[08:41] Vanni Cannoli: All so well said

[08:41] Brianne: thank you

[08:42] Vanni Cannoli: A bunch of years ago I took an acting class, and we did this exercise where we stood with our arms crossed and five others encircled us

[08:42] Vanni Cannoli: Then we closed our eyes and were to just fall over, literally.

[08:42] Vanni Cannoli: And the people caught us and pushed us gently the other way, so we would rock to another person that would catch us and push us back up

[08:42] Porter: giggles at the "THEATAHHH" of it

[08:42] Vanni Cannoli: the idea, according to the instructor, was to build trust with fellow actors

[08:43] Vanni Cannoli: But it was FUCKING SCARY let me tell you

[08:43] Brianne: *laughs*

[08:43] Callie Raziel: Hooray for trust falls.

[08:43] Vanni Cannoli: You had to totally give in to these people, that they would catch you and push you back before you fell and hurt yourself

[08:43] Vanni Cannoli: That came clearly to mind while you were talking about that, Brianne

[08:43] Vanni Cannoli: That in bondage, we give ourselves over to this other person, trusting them to not hurt us while we are incapable of doing anything about it

[08:44] Brianne: that is very appropriate, Vanni

[08:44] Vanni Cannoli: And delighting in the fact that we feel safe while so immoblized

[08:44] Brianne: :)

[08:44] Vanni Cannoli: Theater has lots of interesting exercises, Porter :P

[08:45] Vanni Cannoli: Anyway yes, your comment is very apporpriate and very deep in the psychology of bondage.  Well done, my smexy blond friend!

[08:45] Brianne: Yay!

[08:45] Vanni Cannoli: Thank you!

[08:46] Vanni Cannoli: We go to Sir Lngo please!

[08:46] Lngo Delvalle: For me binding is an acknowledgement of submission.  The sub has crossed a line placing trust and vulnerablity completely in my hands.  Its a powerful tool.  Ounce bound - anything is possible - sex - pain - display - quiet reflection - or isolation - building trust - respecting limits -  I find all of these acts useful in BDSM depending upon what I am trying to accomplish.  The act of binding a sub gives me a sense of power - satisfaction - focus - and puts me completely in control - completely mine - and for me - overwhelming satisfaction. #

[08:46] Brianne: oh goodness, that's hot

[08:46] Pure Delvalle: smiles to her Maitre

[08:47] Vanni Cannoli looks for my ticket dispenser in inventory madly

[08:47] Brianne: *laughs*

[08:47] Vanni Cannoli: "#32!  Now serving #32!"

[08:47] Brianne looks at ticket.  "shit, I'm 99"

[08:47] Vanni Cannoli: Sir Lngo, that was so spot on, and a great flip side to what Brianne was just saying about the same thing from the sub side.

[08:52] Vanni Cannoli: Thank You Sir Lngo!

[08:53] Vanni Cannoli: And oddly enough, we go to Sir Lngo's sexy subby wife!  Pure, you are up please!

[08:53] Venora Magic is online.

[08:53] Pure Delvalle: Being physically restrained frees my mind. I concentrate on what my Maitre is doing to me and the sensations are more intense. The pleasure is also increased tenfold. It is undeniable that to feel such control from Maitre Lngo over my body is what I seek. I am proud to belong to him and I have complete confidence when he ties me up or suspends me. It's sensual, sometimes painful, but so satisfying! To agree with Vanni "the brain is the biggest sex organ": I am fortunate to have RL experience. This is nice, because I can mentally recreate the "feelings" in SL. All profit for my Maitre! smiles. #

[08:57] Vanni Cannoli: We go to Aspen please!

[08:58] Aspen Diamond: Thank you Vanni.

When I was like 10 years old. All of my girlfriends who lived in my neighbor hood were into tying each other up and watching how long it would take us to untie.

Example: we were tied to a bunk beds. Our hands and feet were so tied up that if I pulled on my left leg it would cause tightness on the other girls leg.

I loved being the one who was tied because I could figure out how to get out of it.

I am not a true pain slut slave. . I guess when I first got started in SL and in Gor was what got my kink of bondage like. Then I got really hook. In first life it was going to the Rope Bites, going to the workshops that they offered. Had a very nice rope corset made on me and loved how the ropes made love to my skin.

I do love being restrained and having a Master holding my leash. I feel warm and wanted and know that I am safe and care for.  I know it the Master I play with is a very trusted friend, who has my best being.

Thank you Master Lngo about giving into my complete submission to the

[08:58] Aspen Diamond:  Master of the ropes. I have been teaching myself to relax and my heart will take over and to give all I have. because I know that I am cared for and nothing will happen. Of course I do have my safe word

[08:59] Brianne: Aspen, that's like poetry.

[09:00] Vanni Cannoli: Yes!

[09:00] Aspen Diamond: Thank you

[09:03] Vanni Cannoli: We have heard from many subs, which is great, but only a couple Dominants.  I'd love to hear more Dominant takes on this.

[09:03] Vanni Cannoli: Thanks Aspen!

[09:04] Vanni Cannoli: We go to Danielle please

[09:04] Danielle McGregor: vanni going off what you said earlier about "seeing something happen to our avatar does have strong mental and emotional reactions connected to it." I have a hard time standing for long periods of time because of gor past, I have a need to kneel, sit or be held as standing affects me mentally. And going off what Pure just said "physically restrained frees my mind." there are times when i want to be restrained and times I need it. It is like a tight loving hug or safety blanket for me when in need. It calms my mind and body, allows me ground myself and focus. #

[09:04] Vanni Cannoli: Yes!

[09:04] Brianne nods nods

[09:04] Vanni Cannoli: One of the most mental aspects of Bondage is the calming effect it can have

[09:05] Vanni Cannoli: Which is why a good number of S-Types feel happy just being tied and places at their Dominant's feet

[09:05] Hestia Namaar is aroused by bondage...not calmed!! rawwrrr.... :D

[09:05] ScarletTanager is online.

[09:05] Vanni Cannoli: Well, it can have multiple effects

[09:05] Danielle McGregor: agreed

[09:05] Danielle McGregor: on both

[09:06] Vanni Cannoli: "Side effects include:  calming, arousal, sudden death, 20 minute orgasms..."

[09:06] Vanni Cannoli: "Ask your Dominant about Shibari!"

[09:06] Hestia Namaar blinks....and blushes at Master Ballards comment...

[09:06] Vanni Cannoli: I'll take the 20 minute orgasm for $1000 please

[09:07] Vanni Cannoli: Very good Danielle, I love how you tied the threads we have been talking about together

[09:07] Hestia Namaar Shibari is a sensual and true art form...i am...stunned by its intricate nature.

[09:08] Danielle McGregor: I have had both calming and arousal from bondage so depends how and when it used

[09:08] Vanni Cannoli: Humans are dynamic

[09:08] Vanni Cannoli: The exact same stimulus can have a very different effect on different days

[09:09] Vanni Cannoli: Which means that a Top or Dominant really has to watch carefully when proceeding

[09:09] Aspen Diamond: It is what mood you are in.

[09:09] Vanni Cannoli: And that goes back to trust

[09:09] Danielle McGregor: mood can change blink of an eye

[09:09] Aspen Diamond: Trust is where it is at Vanni.

[09:10] Vanni Cannoli: Thanks Danielle!

[09:10] Vanni Cannoli: Do we have any other comments today?

[09:10] Vanni Cannoli: we still have some time

[09:10] Vanni Cannoli: Go ahead when ready please Master Ballard

[09:10] Ballard: I can't believe the tracker is empty!  What a great topic.  This lies near the heart of BDSM.

[09:11] Ballard: Each of us reacts differently to bondage, from either side. top or bottom.

[09:11] Vanni Cannoli: Yes, from scene to scene!

[09:11] Ballard: Shibari, to me, is a form of art where the bondage experience is the main thing.

[09:11] Danielle McGregor: agreed Master

[09:11] Brianne: and differently on different days.  It really is an adventure

[09:12] Aspen Diamond shaking my head to Master Ballard with a cute smile.

[09:12] Ballard: With shibari the rigger will spend days getting their rope hanks set, singed, and laid down.  Dressing the subject can take hours

[09:12] Pure Delvalle: yes..shibari is the most deep connection Maitre and I can have

[09:13] Brianne: that's what SHE said

[09:13] Vanni Cannoli: ♫ rimshot ♫

[09:13] Ballard: I tend to prefer simpler binds, such as posts.

[09:13] Vanni Cannoli: A funny story from my RL club...

[09:14] Vanni Cannoli: One day a well known Domme tied this guy up who was begging to be tied at our monthly Femdom party.  He wanted to skip all negotiation and get right to it.

[09:14] Vanni Cannoli: Well with an evil look in her eye she agreed.  So know he's tied on this table...

[09:14] Vanni Cannoli: and then he goes "Uh...do you want to know my safeword?"

[09:14] Vanni Cannoli: And she looks at him as she raises a crop and goes "Well, you should have thought of THAT before, yeah?"

[09:15] Vanni Cannoli: The look of SHEER PANIC in this guy's eyes was so delightful!

[09:15] Peaches Svenska: you ARE a sadist, Vanni!

[09:15] Ballard: Thus the lesson.  Negotiate BEFORE the binding

[09:15] Vanni Cannoli: That wasn't me!

[09:15] Vanni Cannoli: Well THAT night...

[09:16] Brianne: Narrator:  It was Vanni that night.

[09:16] Vanni Cannoli: I mean she wasn't about to do anything abusive, but she taught him a good lesson.

[09:18] Vanni Cannoli: Well this was a great dicussion today..up to the end lol

[09:18] Brianne: This has been such a 'stimulating' discussion that I need to go ask my Mistress if today is an O-day.  Whew!  *bites lower lip and sighs quiveringly*  Thank you A/all!!!!!!!  I have this lovely loving feeling in my heart after being with you all.

[09:18] яøυɢє ѕνєиѕкα: c

[09:18] Vanni Cannoli: oh a late cummer, i mean submission...go ahead Rouge!

[09:18] яøυɢє ѕνєиѕкα: thanks vanni, and unusual for me, a short post

[09:18] яøυɢє ѕνєиѕкα: bondage doesn't need to be any intricate binds or rope, leather or chains, a simple collar is bondage in itself #

[09:18] Vanni Cannoli: Yes!

[09:19] Vanni Cannoli: In fact, in many scenes at the club, I just like tell the Bottom "Put your hands HERE and do not move them."  No physical bondage

[09:19] Vanni Cannoli: which of course gives me a chance to do something "horrid" if they move.

[09:19] Pure Delvalle: and some leash are very long...from Tennessee to Quebec

[09:20] яøυɢє ѕνєиѕкα: control of the mind if often more powerful than any physical bindings

[09:20] Vanni Cannoli: Yesssssssssss

[09:20] Katja Luminos is online.

[09:20] Brianne: Vanni, wasn't something like that in Secretary?  I loved that

[09:20] Lngo Delvalle: 1,000 miles :)

[09:20] Vanni Cannoli: Yes!

[09:20] Ballard: Actually that sort of thing is awesome.  Ordering a sub to stand still, hands at their sides, for example while you examine them.  This has an amazing effect

[09:20] Brianne nods nods!!!!

[09:20] Lngo Delvalle: Nods

[09:21] Ballard: yum

[09:21] Vanni Cannoli: "Bend over, put your hands on the desk, read the letter"

[09:21] Pure Delvalle: squirm so much that the cushion complain

[09:21] Vanni Cannoli: That whole scene in that movie had me squirming in my seat

[09:21] Brianne: no lie!

[09:21] яøυɢє ѕνєиѕкα: never seen it

[09:21] Brianne: you must

[09:21] Ballard: great movie Rouge

[09:21] Vanni Cannoli: It has consent issues but is educational to show them as well as aspects of BDSM and D/s

[09:21] Brianne: it's teh antithesis of 50 Shades

[09:22] яøυɢє ѕνєиѕкα: personal services with julie walters is great

[09:22] Brianne makes a note

[09:22] Ballard: it is.  They are both moderately fucked up people, that become whole by coming together

[09:22] Vanni Cannoli: Yes!

[09:22] Brianne: the beauty of D/s!

[09:23] Hestia Namaar after this chat...i am going to have to go take a cold shower....:/

[09:23] Brianne: may I join you?

[09:23] Ballard: Or find a hot partner

[09:23] Brianne: ♫ rimshot ♫

[09:23] Ballard: There you go

[09:23] Vanni Cannoli: lol

[09:23] Vanni Cannoli: Thank you Rouge, that was 100% spot on

[09:23] Hettange Ferryhill is online.

[09:23] Kristeη Siηglesoηg: Please may I be excused...have another engagemnt to attend..

[09:23] Hestia Namaar ponders that idea..hot partner..cold shower...mmmm....

[09:23] Vanni Cannoli: Ok thank Y/you all for participating, next week we get to Discipline