"D is for Discipline" -- February 12, 2023

[08:12] Vanni Cannoli (vanessa.cannoli): Good morning and welcome to Koffee Klatch!

[08:12] Vanni Cannoli (vanessa.cannoli): Before I open the discussion, let me post the usual header:  Our discussions are in text and are in the usual C/Q/R format, meaning type "C" if you wish to make a comment, "Q" if you have a question, usually directed at a person's comments, and "R" if you wish to retract either your C or your Q.  If a person has a question for a specific person on what they said, just say "Q @ [name]"

[08:12] Vanni Cannoli (vanessa.cannoli): We tend to go in the order received, however, we generally will promote questions directed at a person's comment to the top.

[08:13] Vanni Cannoli (vanessa.cannoli): If a person asks a question of the group, there is no need to put in a "C" to reply, replies to the question will be open.  Just answer, or we'll have a bunch of "Cs" at the bottom.

[08:13] Vanni Cannoli (vanessa.cannoli): While we are a chatty group, lots of extra chat makes it "noisy," so if we can please keep that to a minimum, it would be very appreciated, thank Y/you!

[08:13] Vanni Cannoli (vanessa.cannoli): The blog for this munch is:  https://xaarakoffeeklatch.blogspot.com/   It holds the archive for our munches here starting Jan 3, 2021.

 [16:15] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Last week we talked about Bondage, so anyone who may have missed that discussion or wants to review it (with all the nonsense from the troll we had grace us with his flatulence last week removed), it is on the above website.

 

[16:16] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We are going through the BDSM acronym and I expect this will take us into April at least

 

[16:16] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Depending on how much people want to talk about various topics

 

[16:17] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We are going over B/D, last week was Bondage, this week.

 

[16:18] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Discipline is the act of some kind of punishment or correction of a person.

 

[16:19] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We have talked about this a few times, but in the interest of clarity and for newer folks, we have two ways to look at this.

 

[16:19] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): First is actual punishment.  Punishment is a tool in a D/s relationship for the breaking of a rule that has been negotiated between the Dominant and the submissive.  Any rule within the agreed upon limits of the relationship needs to be obeyed, so a punishment is to stop a behavior that is not desired.

 

[16:21] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): In the behavioral sciences, we talk about reinforcement and punishment.  We want to reinforce desired behaviors and punish bad behaviors to keep them from happening.

 

[16:21] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): There are different ways to do both that are beyond the scope of this disucssion really.

 

[16:22] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Now, if we really need to punish any person....wayward child, naughty sub...then the punishment needs to have three characteristics:

 

[16:22] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): First it must be swift, done as close as possible in time to the infraction.

 

[16:23] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Second it must be certain, it WILL happen, or the punisher (not the comic book character) will look weak in the eyes of the person and so not an authority figure.

 

[16:23] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): And third, it must be Rational, meaning the level of punishment is tied to the infraction.

 

[16:23] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Insane punishments for light infractions just breed contempt.

 

[16:24] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): And light punishments for serious infractions teach nothing.

 

[16:24] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): "You killed AGAIN Miss Cannoli?  That's another $100 fine for you!"

 

[16:24] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I'd be droppin' Franklins like candy

 

[16:25] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So that's actual Punishment

 

[16:25] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Good Doms will reinforce positive things in their charges, and use punishment sparingly but WILL do it if/when necessary.

 

[16:26] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): The other kind of Discipline is what we lovingly call here "funishment'

 

[16:26] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Or acts between the Dom and sub that are really more of a negotiated role play to get a scene going.

 

[16:26] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): But are not really infractions of rules.

 

[16:27] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So, just as example....*looks around*...Lyra might "stick her tongue out" at Miss Cherry, and then Miss Cherry spanks her a bit.

 

[16:27] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): If they know between them that such is negotiated and only for getting a bit of a scene going, that's not really "rule breaking"

 

[16:27] Cherry Lysette (Cherry Cloud): Omg, she will never do that ... will she ??? *frowns*

 

[16:27] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): It's funishment

 

[16:28] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I hope I have not given her idea Miss Cherry, but you might have to punish her!

 

[16:28] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Spank her!  And then....spank me!

 

[16:28] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Lots of Dom and subs have little games they play with each other that are negotiated, or even parts of larger role plays.

 

[16:30] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): For those of Y/you that know Miss Tann and her sub Aoisle, there is lots of banter between them that might look like Aoisle is misbehaving, but it is negotiated fun between them that allows them the interplay they both enjoy.  Aoisle would not actually disobey her owner.  I know her well enough.

 

[16:30] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So that's all good.

 

[16:30] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So finally getting to the questions for the day

 

[16:31] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): 1) Do Y/you enjoy "funishment" and do Y/you use it in your D/s interactions, or not?  (some will not, seeing it trite)

 

[16:31] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): and 2) If there is real discipline that needs to be administered, how is it handled?

 

[16:31] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We start with Master Abraham, please

 

[16:31] Abraham Jacobson (abrahamjacobs2 Resident): Discipline is not just beating. For my girls who are used to whip in RL , a beating is fun, and a whip a play toy. I have to things like disapproval, isolation in a cage, or just not talking to them for a day. But , that needs to be followed up with love and caring when the point is made . Or make up sex. But , i have seen too many let their women control them with no correction. Or treat other masters poorly with no consequences. It usually ends with if you have any problems with what i just said , go to my master who then does a thats ok baby. A sub represents who he is and should shine if he is there or not and be disciplined if she does not act well.

 

[16:32] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli):  nods

 

[16:32] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): What You described Master is really a form of "Topping from the Bottom"

 

[16:33] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): And while we can't judge what others do, I think most of us here find that kind of thing unacceptable.

 

[16:33] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): And I think I speak for my fellow subs here when I say all most if not all of us need to hear is something like "You did wrong, I'm disappointed you couldn't follow through or do what you were told."

 

[16:34] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): After you recover from your self-induced cry-coma, you're begging forgiveness minus anything else.

 

[16:35] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Very well said, thank You Master!

 

[16:35] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Aspen has a question!

 

[16:36] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident): Thank you Vanni,  What about us subs that are not owned? If we do something wrong and it should be discipline by who?

 

[16:36] Ballard (Ballard Svenska): By me, of course

 

[16:37] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Well on an interpersonal D/s level Aspen, you have no real rules so you're not doing anything "wrong" in that regard.

 

[16:37] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): On a Xaara level, if you broke some rule of the sim, you would have to answer to the Dominants here, up to Master Laz.

 

[16:37] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Also I believe you are a Community Slave?  They have to answer to Master Roman and above.

 

[16:38] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident): By not addressing a dominate right and If I had a Master then I should have been discipline.

 

[16:39] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Well you do need to follow sim rules for subs, but if some person thought you were supposed to use a title beyond what is required, that person really need to examine the website.

 

[16:39] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): "Opinion" =/= "Rules"

 

[16:40] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Some guy a few years ago IMed me that I was supposed to call him "High Lordship"....no joke.  It was in his profile

 

[16:40] Arella McGregor (Arella4 Resident): chokes

 

[16:40] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I'm like "when did you join the Peerage?"

 

[16:41] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): He blocked me quickly...poor me.  I lost a *great* chance....*sobs*

[16:41] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thanks Aspen!

 

[16:42] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We go to the Blonde Devil in the cool Red Dress!

 

[16:42] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): Okay, I went Rouge and thought ahead today....

 

[16:42] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): I'm not sure if or how this fits the spectrum of discipline, maybe as reinforcing desired behavior, pre-emptive discipline(?), maybe you can tell me, but my Mistress has given me rules that constrain my behavior and mold my mind and attitude.  Things that earn disapproval if I don't obey.  Things like only nudity at home, a greeting ritual, and the requirement that every time I log on, I must say, in public chat, whether I'm alone or not, "Dolls are toys that please others.  I am a doll."  That last one is new for past few weeks and I can't describe the wonderful feelings I get from doing that.  What I can say is that Mistress is very wise to remind me of my place and the pleasure I find in adhering to her expectations.  I want more!

 

[16:42] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): If all goes to plan, at the end of this month,  I'll be spending 9 days as a very restricted pony/mare at a ranch I'm joining, subject to all sorts of discipline, I expect.  (I may not be at Klatch during that time.)  I'm a little wary of being so controlled but at the same time I'm over-the-moon excited about it, looking forward to it, as I'm sure many subs can understand.  I hope that I can meet that challenge of obeying the ranch rules and being pleasing.

 

[16:44] Arella McGregor (Arella4 Resident): Yay Brianne!  (Gets out Carrie's Story and retitles it for Brianne)

 

[16:44] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): In behavioral science we differentiate between Reinforcement and Punishment.  What Miss Katie is doing is reinforcing what she wants you to do with praise (so it's positive)

 

[16:45] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): And sending you off to be ponified for a week

 

[16:45] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): I do respond to that pretty well.

 

[16:45] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): As you said you are looking forward to that, it's also a form of reinforcement

 

[16:46] яøυɢє ѕνєиѕкα (RougeLaroux Resident):  is super happy for brianne, and wishes her all the best. loving the idea of being locked down like that for x period of time

 

[16:46] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We don't talk about "reward" when discussing behavior modification, btw.  It's either to reinforce desired behavior or discard unwanted behavior.

 

[16:46] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident):  nods

 

[16:46] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So the bondage is being used to modify your behaviors.  You go, sister!

 

[16:46] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): ^ ^

 

[16:47] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thank you Brianne!

 

[16:47] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): Thank you!

 

[16:47] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We move on to Peaches please!

 

[16:47] Peaches Svenska (Peaches Gapchenko): Thank you Vannie.

Please dont worry about what I'm about to say, everything is good now but...

 

I was an abused child, both physically and sexually so, surprise, surprise, I can't endure being whipped,

 

This is NOT a problem for my Master because,,,well,,,I'm an ANGEL! HAHAHA. But seriously, I can't think of anything, in the last 13+ years, I cant think of any punishable offenses that I have done.

 

There have been a few occasions where Master has had to step in and say, "ok ladies, thats enough", when Candy and I have had a few sisterly words. But other than that...

 

I would rather be whipped bloody by my God Emperor than to even disappoint him.. If I were to embarrass him or dishonor him in some way,, I think I would simply die.#

 

[16:48] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Yes indeed!

 

[16:48] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident):  nods knowingly and appreciatively of Peaches

 

[16:49] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Subs and slaves are extensions of their owners as Master Abraham said, our behaviors should always be with them and their prestige in mind.

 

[16:49] Ballard (Ballard Svenska):  takes on a thoughtful expression as he tries to recall Peaches actually doing something 'puinishable'.  "Calling me God Emperor" makes it all good

 

[16:49] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): it's not unlike how snotty brat kids in public make the parents look "non-parental"

 

[16:50] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): "Can't they control their kids, what kind of idiots are they?"

 

[16:50] яøυɢє ѕνєиѕкα (RougeLaroux Resident):  knows has danced that line a few times in the early days, and soon learned her lesson

 

[16:52] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Peaches, thank you for that, your contributions are always timely and pleasing to your God-Emperor. *grins*

 

[16:52] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We move on to Miss Cherry, please!

 

[16:52] Cherry Lysette (Cherry Cloud): Thank you Vanni

 

[16:52] Cherry Lysette (Cherry Cloud): For those who know me, i am not into hard punishment. Like Vanni has put it, a word of disapproval can weigh harder than a real 'physical punishment' Telling your subbe that you disapprove should be enough. After all it's a set of rules that shouldhave been agreed on before we start our "play". If your sub doesn't takes that serious, you can wonder if you are not wasting your time. Same goes for the Domme / Master by the way. 

"Funishment' on the other hand is a very core item of my interaction. Things should be FUN for both Domme and Subbe. After all we all work hard enough in RL, and we are here to show our love and respect to each other. That should not be hard work, but an act of commitment. I disagree with people that take themselves too serious. You only have to read the news to see how that ends up....

 

[16:53] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Well said, Miss!

 

[16:53] Cherry Lysette (Cherry Cloud): Thank you vanni :-)

 

[16:55] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We always need to remember that everyone in this lifestyle approaches it differently...some very relaxed, some very seriously, and anything in between.  What's important is what works for *U/us*

 

[16:56] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Rules should be taken seriously, but they are the rules that the Dom and sub create between them, not rules that apply to anyone else.  So I find it amusing when others think *I* should be living by their rules.

 

[16:56] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): But it occasionally happens lol.

 

[16:57] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): You know, like how I'm supposed to cook and clean and iron shirt and give a blow job to Sir C.....well him.  Yep, that's happening.

 

[16:58] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Miss Cherry thank You!  Well said and a great first contribution to our Sunday chats!

[16:58] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Does anyone else have a comment or question or our topic?  *noting the empty chairs and figuring bowls of Cheetos are being filled as we speak*

 

[17:01] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident): I  need the discipline and structure. But I love the Funishment because that is the icing on the cake..

 

[17:02] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Funishment is fun as long as it's clear what the parameters of the "misbehavior" are.

 

[17:02] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Meaning, the limits needs to be clear

 

[17:03] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Some s-types, especially Brats, like pushing those limits.

 

[17:03] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident): I do need the correction of my behavior at time when I stick my foot in my mouth.

 

[17:03] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): But as long as it's clear what the "infraction" is and that's it's just a way to get something going that is acceptable between both, it's fine.

[17:04] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thank you Aspen!

 

[17:04] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Anyone else?

 

[17:05] Ballard (Ballard Svenska): Vanni, thank you for leading a fine and interesting discussion.  Go Chiefs

"B is for Bondage" -- February 5, 2022

[16:10] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Ok as everyone finds seats let's go ahead and start up

 

[16:10] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Good morning and welcome to Koffee Klatch!

 

[16:10] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Before I open the discussion, let me post the usual header:  Our discussions are in text and are in the usual C/Q/R format, meaning type "C" if you wish to make a comment, "Q" if you have a question, usually directed at a person's comments, and "R" if you wish to retract either your C or your Q.  If a person has a question for a specific person on what they said, just say "Q @ [name]"

 

[16:11] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We tend to go in the order received, however, we generally will promote questions directed at a person's comment to the top.

 

[16:11] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): If a person asks a question of the group, there is no need to put in a "C" to reply, replies to the question will be open.  Just answer, or we'll have a bunch of "Cs" at the bottom.

 

[16:11] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): While we are a chatty group, lots of extra chat makes it "noisy," so if we can please keep that to a minimum, it would be very appreciated, thank Y/you!

 

[16:12] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): The blog for this munch is:  https://xaarakoffeeklatch.blogspot.com/   It holds the archive for our munches here starting Jan 3, 2021.

 

[16:13] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): For those of you that have come regularly to this discussion for the four or so years I have hosted it at this day/time (unbelievable), you know that at the beginning of the year or so we take time to go over the entire BDSM acronym.

 

[16:13] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): This goes from about February to April or May, depending how chatty we all are on some topics *grins*

 

[16:14] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): BDSM as an acronym stands for three things:  B/D:  Bondage and Discipline, S/M:  Sadism and Masochism, and D/s:  Dominance and Submission

 

[16:15] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Our goal over these discussions is to talk out how W/we all see this and how these things affect U/us.

 

[16:15] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Everyone has their own experiences in this and all are valid, no matter how little one has had (yet) or how deep into the pool one has dived.

[16:17] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Ok, so today we start with the B/D part of the acronym:  Bondage!

 

[16:17] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): To quote Wikipedia, which knows all, Bondage "is the practice of consensually tying, binding, or restraining a partner for erotic, aesthetic, or somatosensory stimulation. A partner may be physically restrained in a variety of ways, including the use of rope, cuffs, bondage tape, or self-adhering bandage."

 

[16:18] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Now, bondage is often an act in and of itself, meaning that the people involved will do that as a scene in itself

 

[16:18] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): At my First Life club, there are many scenes where a person is tied in some way, such as suspension, and that's the scene, and the act in and of itself puts the bottom into subspace

 

[16:19] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I do really love watching the riggers do their work, hoisting people up in rope and spinning them around.

 

[16:19]  ( ): Lyra Lysette swipes Lyra's juicy round butt with a resounding 'Slap!!' It starts to redden - Lyra bites her lip and purrs 'Mmmmmmmm again please!'

 

[16:19] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): however, I don't do it as I have zero patience for such things, I like either beating a person silly NOW or getting smacked around NOW.

 

[16:20] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We also have people that love mummification

 

[16:20] Abby (AbbiiLynn Resident): cringes

 

[16:20] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Getting wrapped up in some kind of saran wrap material like a mummy, and often hoisted up, or left in a corner somewhere

 

[16:21] Sylvie Delvalle (Pureperle Anton): chuckles...some do that to lose weight

 

[16:21] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): My usual play partner likes me tying her to the St. Andrew's Cross or whatever thing we're using for a scene.  I have cuffs with rings and I attach easy-offs to each one,so I can tie her down quickly AND release her quickly were something to happen and she needs to be releasede

 

[16:22] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Also with this, use of handcuffs, leg irons, arm spreaders, gags, latex body suits, hoods....*subspace is coming*...are possible, and MORE!  LOTS MORE!

 

[16:22] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Now, with this comes a LOT of safety

 

[16:23] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): One can't just leave a person tied down somewhere.

 

[16:23] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): In SL some people do this, but in First Life, this is a serious breach of protocol

 

[16:23] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): If during a scene where I'm topping at the club, if I need to leave the room for a moment, I get someone to watch over the bottom until I come back

 

[16:24] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): if a Dungeon Monitor were to see a tied person left alone, they would stop the scene right there and release the person

 

[16:24] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): You can't EVER leave a person tied somewhere unattended.

 

[16:24] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): In First Life, that is.

 

[16:25] RB Quinn (RBQuinn Resident): c@Vanni

 

[16:25] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Yes, Master RB?

 

[16:26] RB Quinn (RBQuinn Resident): I would point out that if your partner is very immersive, leaving them alone while bound can trigger great fear, and is a very bad thing.#

 

[16:26] RB Quinn (RBQuinn Resident): even in SL

 

[16:26] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I agree!

 

[16:26] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I don't like being left alone, I'm immersive and interactive

 

[16:27] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): but there are Dom s and subs that like either tying their charge up, or being tied up in SL, and left that way for some time

 

[16:27] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): As long as that's cool with both HERE that's fine IMO Master.

 

[16:27] RB Quinn (RBQuinn Resident): takes two to tango

 

[16:27] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): But should never be forced.

 

[16:27] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Now here in SL, bondage to the Avi is one of those things that has a lot of play of the mind, as unless a person is mirroring the acts at home, it's mental which is great!

 

[16:28] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): And most if now all of us love aspects of Bondage play here in SL.

 

[16:28] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So my questions to the august assembly are two:

 

[16:28] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): 1) What techniques of Bondage turn Y/you on?  What gets the motor running?

 

[16:28] novαleιgh Veѕpolι (Novaleigh Freng): C

 

[16:29] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): and 2) what precautions and thought do Y/you put into bondage scenes here?  What kind of rules and norms guide SL bondage?

 

[16:29] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We will start with Candice and go to Master Ballard :)

 

[16:29] Candice Svenska (CandiceElla Resident): thank You Vanni, i personally love bondage of most kinds, swaying more towards the pain side of bondage, however it must be with someone i hold trust in, the thrill of knowing you surrender everything is beyond orgasmic #

 

[16:30] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Yes, the thrill that you know anything COULD happen as one is helpless that gets the bottom/sub really going IMO

 

[16:30] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Which also says a lot about the aspect of trust in a scene

 

[16:32] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Master Ballard you are up please!

 

[16:32] Ballard (Ballard Svenska): When asked about my feelings towards BDSM, I have often said that I am into the BD, and not so much the SM. 

The act of bondage is somehow quite gratifying.  It is a taking control over, and setting a place for the object of control.  I lean towards the simpler side of bondage, preferring cuffs, spreaders, posts, and so on.  The focus is the body of my subject.  It is always about the female body.

I get a huge charge out of capture/rape role play.  So damn exciting.

Even better is the discipline side.  Knowing that a person lives under my rules, and honors my house by being obedient to the rules even when I'm not around, is a great feeling it.,  It feels like love, commitment, respect.  #

 

[16:35] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I appreciate your comments Master Ballard, all of that sounds really yummy and we all appreciate how You and your family interacts.

 

[16:35] shanni Jacobson (Shannondoa Resident): how does rape have anything to do with love , commitment or respect

 

[16:35] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): He means a CNC scene where it's played out, not really grabbing a person and raping them, Shanni

 

[16:37] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I hope that helps, Shanni?

 

[16:37] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Moving on, Nova you are up please!

 

[16:37] novαleιgh Veѕpolι (Novaleigh Freng): What about forniphilia? It's personally something I really enjoy. I'm claustrophobic (sp?) so I can't do something like mummification - I'd panic. But forniphilia is a bit different. Movement is still restricted but not in the same way. I'm not sure why but it's a "zen" thing for me as opposed to a "trapped" thing. Here in SL I don't appreciate simply being left without reason, as I don't in RL. It kind of ruins the immersion for me, but that's a conversation had before I ever start a scene, of course. I won't scene with someone until we're both on the same page.

 

[16:38] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Right and that's very important.  When doing bondage, everyone needs to be on the same page and understand the risks involved.

 

[16:38] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): If/when he shows up with the alt, please block that as well.

 

[16:39] novαleιgh Veѕpolι (Novaleigh Freng): Not sure if you'd consider that one under B for Bondage or O for Objectification - I suppose depending on who you speak to it could be both, but it's a personal favorite of mine.

 

[16:39] Ɛɱɱą Ɛŋƈɧąŋէɱεŋէ (Emma Enchantment): Q@ Nova, what is Forniphilla?

 

[16:39] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): go ahead and explain it Nova :)

 

[16:40] novαleιgh Veѕpolι (Novaleigh Freng): it is when you are bound like furniture, essentially, or incorporated into a piece of furniture, like a table, for example. I think that's the simplest way I can explain it.

 

[16:40] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Or made into it...like being made into a lamp or an ottoman or something

 

[16:40] Ɛɱɱą Ɛŋƈɧąŋէɱεŋէ (Emma Enchantment): oh, thats interesting

 

[16:41] Ɛɱɱą Ɛŋƈɧąŋէɱεŋէ (Emma Enchantment): gets my lampshade out and not cause its tequila night

 

[16:41] novαleιgh Veѕpolι (Novaleigh Freng): yes and it is so relaxing (to me lol)

 

[16:41] Peaches Svenska (Peaches Gapchenko):   considers being a piano

 

[16:41] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): it's a form of objectification and also falls under humiliation and bondage..everything has multiple possibilities!

 

[16:42] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thanks Nova!

 

[16:42] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We move on to Abby please!

 

[16:42] Abby (AbbiiLynn Resident): I went to a kinky Campout once near Kansas city.. They did a ton of demonstrations and classes kind of like Xaara ..

 

[16:43] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Yes!

 

[16:43] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Damn I can't remember the term but yes, I've seen that done!

 

[16:43] Abby (AbbiiLynn Resident): P.S. they taught us never to leave anyone who is bound in RL alone for more then a few minutes.. it can go from perfectly fine to life threatening distress in a heart beat #

 

[16:43] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): basically like a mummifcation

 

[16:43] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): 100% agreed Abby

 

[16:43] Ɛɱɱą Ɛŋƈɧąŋէɱεŋէ (Emma Enchantment): Agrees completely

 

[16:44] Abby (AbbiiLynn Resident): i just couldn't lol

 

[16:44] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): lol not quite Master, in this the person can breathe just fine, the tube in their mouth allows breath

 

[16:44] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I just can't remember the term

 

[16:44] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Anyway yes, very much a form of bondage, Abby!

 

[16:44] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I haven't tried it myself but people that have said it feels very deeply relaxing

 

[16:44] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): but for a person like Nova it would be instant panic

 

[16:45] Candice Svenska (CandiceElla Resident): nods

 

[16:45] Abby (AbbiiLynn Resident): yeah me too.. and i have been bound that was fine

 

[16:47] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thanks Abby for the comment! :)

 

[16:47] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We move to Sir Lngo please!

 

[16:47] Lngo Delvalle (Lngo Delvalle): Sylvie and I have achieved a hight level of trust.  Life in RL and SL can be quite busy and the mind can run a million miles a minuite in many directions .  In order to provide calm and focus and proper transition, I will instruct Sylvie to lock herself in a cage and wait for me.  The purpose is to prepare the mind and create a sense of focus and anticipation.  Its all about the mind afterall :)  I may not be present, but I am available in IM, and this is not a very long period - perhaps 10 minutes.  This may appear to break the safety rule but she is consensual and the process achieves its purpose and enhances the play session that follows. #

 

[16:48] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Do you mean in First or Second Life, Sir?

 

[16:48] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): The cage?

 

[16:48] Sylvie Delvalle (Pureperle Anton): lower her head...sadly this girl dont have place for a cage in RL at the moment...

 

[16:48] Lngo Delvalle (Lngo Delvalle): only in Sl - but - I would do in RL if I where in the same structure - but perhaps not in the same room.

 

[16:49] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): nods nods

 

[16:49] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): well that's just fine here Sir, as Y/you are in contact and if she were to panic or something was wrong she could ask permission to get out

 

[16:49] Sylvie Delvalle (Pureperle Anton): But I must add that I stay kneel RL and clear my mind as Maitre asked me

 

[16:49] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Very nice!

 

[16:49] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I see no ethical issues there at all Sir :)

 

[16:50] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): But I'm sure poor Sylvie just "hates" it *grins and winks*

 

[16:50] Lngo Delvalle (Lngo Delvalle): yes would never be out of earshot... and would not be and extended period - and woudl never leave the building or be out of earshot.

 

[16:50] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Scare quotes very intentional

 

[16:50] Lngo Delvalle (Lngo Delvalle): yes she screams and cries the whole time :)

 

[16:50] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Poor girl

 

[16:51] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thanks Sir Lngo!

 

[16:51] Master Captain Phoenix (Norton Lykin): tc

 

[16:52] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Ok Blondie, this is your chance for redemption here!

 

[16:52] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): Apparently, my Mistress is prescient and made me a visual aid for today's topic of Bondage.  And I'm glad of it.  Becoming helpless and dependent and objectified is a major turn on for me, the driving one behind my interest in BDSM and D/s in the first place, and why I joined SL to learn more.  It's not the same here than First Life, true, but the emotional benefits of being restrained are delicious in any form. #

 

[16:53] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli):   hopes the Tops and Dom s in the room were taking careful notes to what Brianne said

 

[16:53] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident):   giggles

 

[16:53] RB Quinn (RBQuinn Resident): writing furiously.....

 

[16:53] Candice Svenska (CandiceElla Resident): sends update memo

 

[16:53] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli):   giggles

 

[16:53] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): *laughs*

 

[16:54] Xander (Werewolf13769 Resident): *looks up from my notebook*

 

[16:54] Abby (AbbiiLynn Resident): lol

 

[16:54] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): *laughs*

 

[16:54] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): you all make me feel good.

 

[16:54] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): It's why I love confessions...I write down the sins confessed very carefully so I can apply them in my life at a later time

 

[16:54] Ɛɱɱą Ɛŋƈɧąŋէɱεŋէ (Emma Enchantment): we all think you feel really good :)

 

[16:54] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): yay!

 

[16:54] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): *laughs*

 

[16:55] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Brianne I love everything you said there

 

[16:55] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): Thank you, Vanni

 

[16:55] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Both the way it gets your motor running and how your Mistress takes the time to get it going for you with proper care

 

[16:55] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident):   nods nods!

 

[16:56] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thanks Bri!

 

[16:56] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We move to Aspen please!

 

[16:56] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident): Thank you Vanni,

What turns me on in bondage play is also the Mind Fuck also. I love when being tied up on a table, on a counter, Hanging in a sex swing and ect. I love standing in front of a Master being naked with hands behind my back and just waiting for that touch of the Master. As my pussy starts dripping as you watch or had down waiting.

I love the way that I can surrender and give my submission to that Master who I completely trust and who will honer my safe words. A Dominant has to watch where he is coming from in the scene. Is he watching his submissive and her actions. Allot of you who does know me well that if and when I give my submission to knows we know what rules we are following. Play SSC if you are starting out and the your trust will build with each other. I had a partner who I trusted when he did knife play with me. It was so exciting to me because I gave him my submission to him as he drew things on my body with the knives I was in such relax subspace. But still was able to us my safe

[08:56] Aspen Diamond:  words. I did love him tying me up on the table since he was a rigger himself with great artistry.

 The cage I have been in both Real and SL. It is being naked and no place to hide. It is the time to focus and calm to where you only think of breathing and the touch of your Master and how you will serve and pleasure your Master. You set your mind on him and then he in turn will either reward or discipline. I want both. I love giving my submission to the Right Master who understand this sub.

 

[16:57] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): All so well said!

 

[16:57] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Just to clarify something

 

[16:57] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Knifeplay does not equal Bloodplay

 

[16:57] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Knifeplay is using a knife to scrape the skin

 

[16:57] Candice Svenska (CandiceElla Resident): absolutely not

 

[16:57] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident): No bloodplay

 

[16:58] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): As Aspen said, even to draw a design with scratches perhaps

 

[16:58] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): but no real cutting

 

[16:58] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): it's the IDEA that could happen, the trust one has in their Top or Dom  that makes that so super exciting

 

[16:58] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident): None Vanni but it is the feel how it is done with someone knows how to do it right. Done

 

[16:59] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We had a guy at my club that was into bloodplay, he did a few scenes going that involved actual cutting.  And he would wear a mask like a "Phantom of the Opera" mask or even a skull mask.  He freaked a lot of people out, but I found the scenes fascinating

 

[17:01] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Anyway, Aspen as usual I love hearing your thoughts and how open you are with your desires.

 

[17:01] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): we move to Peaches please!

 

[17:02] Peaches Svenska (Peaches Gapchenko): Thanks Vanni, My best experience, so far, was with the use of Shabari.

During my Aspirant program, I had to do research and I sought out an experienced Master to ask about it. He explained everything as he went, and even though I'm an 'emoting snob', I found myself in subspace! in spite of his uninspiring emoting

 

It was not about the emoting, it was the knowing. Knowing that I was 'literally' helpless and vulnerable! That is what set me off!

 

When I looked at this, from an unlearned psychological POV, I realized that due to the sexual abuse I endured as a child, I came to feel sex was bad, and that I was a bad girl if I enjoyed it, So as an adult, I struggled with being willing. That bad girl whisper starts, but when i'm bound, it stops. I remind myself that i'm not a bad girl, I cant help what is happening when i'm bound, and I cant help how my body reacts, sooooo....I f#*$ing love it! #

 

[17:02] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): WOOT!

 

[17:03] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I'm not a clinician so I can't really comment on the effects you describe, Peaches, but it definitely sounds like you found something to deal with the things in your past in a healthy way.

 

[17:04] Lngo Delvalle (Lngo Delvalle): All about the mind

 

[17:04] Candice Svenska (CandiceElla Resident): nods lots

 

[17:04] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): It reminds me of the movie "Secretary" -- how she used BDSM to transcend her self-destructive behaviors

 

[17:05] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We still have some time left, so does anyone else have something to share about Bondage, how it turns Y/you on, and what Y/you do to get it going either in First or Second Life?

 

[17:06] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Master RB whenever You are ready please

 

[17:07] RB Quinn (RBQuinn Resident): One 'problem' with bondage in SL is that it can be too 'easy' -- Push a button an .. voila... the sub is fully tied up and swinging from a frame, etc.  I have found that the "process" of tying, binding, restraining, is very erotic on both sides when time is taken to emote what is being done, and hearing the response to it.#

 

[17:07] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Yessssssss

 

[17:07] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): It totally helps with the 'Theater of the Mind' I agree Master!

 

[17:09] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Well said, thank You Master!

 

[17:09] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Nova back to you please!

 

[17:10] novαleιgh Veѕpolι (Novaleigh Freng): For me, I will mirror certain activities here, but bondage is not one of them. I feel it's safer when there are others present, but apart from fornifilia, I really just enjoy cuffs and/or gags. Anything that gives me pause to "slow down" if that makes sense is like a 13/10 in my book because being bound like that or gagged kinda forces me to stop, and in my rl everything is go go go all the time. #

 

[17:10] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): nods big

 

[17:10] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): A lot of people say the same, Nova

 

[17:10] novαleιgh Veѕpolι (Novaleigh Freng): mhmm. favorite thing I think!

 

[17:11] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Just as Submission can remove the decision making necessity from the s-type, Bondage can allow a person to just center

 

[17:11] Sylvie Delvalle (Pureperle Anton): Just be ME!

 

[17:11] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Feel the restraints and let go, trusting the other with their welfare and time

 

[17:11] Candice Svenska (CandiceElla Resident): absolutely

 

[17:11] novαleιgh Veѕpolι (Novaleigh Freng): being gagged also prevents my lack of a filter from getting me into trouble sometimes, too... but that may be another conversation entirely lol

 

[17:11] Ɛɱɱą Ɛŋƈɧąŋէɱεŋէ (Emma Enchantment): Bondage to me likens  the Level of TPE I desire.

 

[17:12] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Anyway yes, you hit the mental aspect of Bondage very well Nova

 

[17:13] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I do yoga, and the whole point of doing the poses, the asanas, is to train the body to sit and be still

 

[17:13] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So bondage can have a very similar effect...in a different way of course

 

[17:14] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thanks so much Nova!

 

[17:14] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We go to Master Ballard again please!

 

[17:14] Ballard (Ballard Svenska): In all of this we never talked about Leashes.  I'm rather surprised this went without mention.  A leash is a bond, a connection, a restraint.  When leashed a submissive falls under different rules and etiquette.   Any comments on this?  Is it not considered a form of bondage?

 

[17:14] Abby (AbbiiLynn Resident): Yessssss

 

[17:14] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Yes!

 

[17:15] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): A leash is certainly a form of restraint, Master.  And a pretty yummy one!

 

[17:15] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): I consider a leash and ESSENTIAL aspect of D/s and is bondage in my mind.

 

[17:15] Ballard (Ballard Svenska):   leashes his girls, just to feel them bound to him

 

[17:15] RB Quinn (RBQuinn Resident): Leashing is relatively mild, but it is still emotionally powerful 'bondage', with all the nuances of owning and being owned

 

[17:15] Peaches Svenska (Peaches Gapchenko): mmmm..you know i sooo very much love to be leashed my Master!! makes me feel safe, loved, owned

 

[17:15] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Yes, being "reeled in" is very yummy

 

[17:15] Sylvie Delvalle (Pureperle Anton): turn hear to look her Maitre who keep her on leash most of the time...sad that some sim dont allow that...

 

[17:15] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): and one can only go so far

 

[17:15] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): Sir RB, that is very well said.

 

[17:16] Ballard (Ballard Svenska): Also, having rules for the leashed enhances it

 

[17:16] Lyra Lysette (Lyra Lysette):   wonders about etiquette when leashed.........

 

[17:16] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Everyone has different protocols, Lyra

 

[17:16] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident): Answer to Master Ballard question?

 

[17:17] Lyra Lysette (Lyra Lysette): thank you Vanni

 

[17:17] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): oh go right ahead Aspen

 

[17:17] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident): I just love when you are with the right person being in their present and you can trust completely . I love to be leash and walking behind the Master. " Love watching his ass move. "

 

[17:19] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Back to Lyra's question for just a sec, then we'll close with Abby

 

[17:20] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): When leashed the sub might just be held close

 

[17:20] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): or given strict orders

 

[17:20] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): "You can't try to go past the range" or "you can't speak while leashed"

 

[17:20] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So it's part of the bondage interplay between the D and the s

 

[17:20] Peaches Svenska (Peaches Gapchenko): we svenska girls have to walk in formation

 

[17:20] RB Quinn (RBQuinn Resident): "which side of the dominant to walk or kneel"

 

[17:20] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Yes!

 

[17:21] Lyra Lysette (Lyra Lysette): Ahhhhhh thank you Vanni xoxo

 

[17:21] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): Svenkas == Blue Angels of BDSM

 

[17:21] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I had a mistress years ago who was very big on training us to walk in stride with her

 

[17:21] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So there are many things that can be done with all manner of Bondage implements

 

[17:22] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): My Mistress does the same with me, and it's harder than it looks!  But I love practicing our leash-walk

 

[17:22] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Same with gags, they can do that annoying "green text" if the sub tries to speak with it in.  I was trained to say *nothing* was gagged.  Only emote a thing I could reasonably do

 

[17:22] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): *while gagged

 

[17:23] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): it took a lot of control and was very educational for me

 

[17:23] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): lol exactlyl!

 

[17:23] Ballard (Ballard Svenska): We have written rules for the leash

 

[17:23] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I was even sent to do a DJ gig gagged a couple times

 

[17:24] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): and had to do it silent

 

[17:24] Xander (Werewolf13769 Resident): now that sounds like a challenge Vanni

 

[17:24] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Hey the pride in my heart hearing "you did it, well done girl"

 

[17:24] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): yes!!!!!

 

[17:24] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): subbies will understand that well

 

[17:24] Candice Svenska (CandiceElla Resident): nods

 

[17:24] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): ^ ^

 

[17:24] Lyra Lysette (Lyra Lysette): mmmmmmmmmmmm

 

[17:24] Sylvie Delvalle (Pureperle Anton): I think bondage in SL is a challenge!! more we know each others, more it become complex

 

[17:25] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): yes!

 

[17:25] Lngo Delvalle (Lngo Delvalle): Nods

 

[17:25] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident):   nods!

 

[17:25] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident): Love those words of praise from your Dom.

 

[17:25] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): yesssssss

 

[17:25] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thanks Master Ballard!

 

[17:25] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Abby you have the last word today!

 

[17:26] Abby (AbbiiLynn Resident): I love the leash .. not just because it's a slight form of bondage .. it's very symbolic ..I physical demonstration of my emotional connection to my Master ..my Ex RL Master had a pocket chain he would attach to me when we were out.. not overtly Obvious but soooo hot what if someone noticed.. He knew i was leashed I knew it .. love it # please take one more comment I am not a closer lol ## The True Collar is worn around the heart##

 

[17:26] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): YES!

 

[17:26] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Amen to that sister

 

[17:26] Master Captain Phoenix (Norton Lykin): well said

 

[17:26] Arella McGregor (Arella4 Resident): Smiles @ Abby

 

[17:26] Candice Svenska (CandiceElla Resident): :)

 

[17:26] Abby (AbbiiLynn Resident): in the words of Elvis "thank you very much"

 

[17:27] Joel Lightfoot (JoelJSA Resident): Great close, Abby!

 

[17:27] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): My friends in a 24/7 rl relationship wear two lockets when in the vanilla world

 

[17:27] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): She, the slave, wears a lock, and he, the Dom, wears a key

 

[17:27] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): People who know them know exactly what that means

 

[17:27] novαleιgh Veѕpolι (Novaleigh Freng): I had a bracelet I wore, but similar idea.

 

[17:27] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): I like that

 

[17:27] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): but it looks very vanilla

 

[17:28] Candice Svenska (CandiceElla Resident): awesome, great topic as always Vanni :)

 

[17:28] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thank you Abby and A/all!

"Freedom in BDSM" -- January 29, 2023

 

[16:11] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Good morning and welcome to Koffee Klatch!

 

[16:11] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Before I open the discussion, let me post the usual header:  Our discussions are in text and are in the usual C/Q/R format, meaning type "C" if you wish to make a comment, "Q" if you have a question, usually directed at a person's comments, and "R" if you wish to retract either your C or your Q.  If a person has a question for a specific person on what they said, just say "Q @ [name]"

 

[16:12] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We tend to go in the order received, however, we generally will promote questions directed at a person's comment to the top.

 

[16:12] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): If a person asks a question of the group, there is no need to put in a "C" to reply, replies to the question will be open.  Just answer, or we'll have a bunch of "Cs" at the bottom.

 

[16:12] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): While we are a chatty group, lots of extra chat makes it "noisy," so if we can please keep that to a minimum, it would be very appreciated, thank Y/you!

 

[16:12] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): The blog for this munch is:  https://xaarakoffeeklatch.blogspot.com/   It holds the archive for our munches here starting Jan 3, 2021.

 

[16:13] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So, today our discussion is on "Freedom", one that we have had a couple times over the four or so years I've been heading this group

 

[16:14] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): A lot of people say that the BDSM and D/s lifestyle are very "Freeing" to them.

 

[16:14] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): And I've often wondered how exactly that's meant.

 

[16:14] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): For example, for the s-type in a D/s relationship, there is a lot less "freedom"

 

[16:15] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): And even the D-type is under consensual restraints to their sub/slave

 

[16:15] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): and last night I went to the local BDSM club and did rather perverse things *cough*

 

[16:15] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident):  perks up!

 

[16:16] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): so...I'm free to be my own perverse self!

 

[16:16] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Which is what a lot of the "Morality Squad" like to say about our lifestyle, we support the downfall of all that is good.  They see us as irresponsible!

 

[16:17] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): First of all, f**k that.

 

[16:17] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): But in a broader scope, with freedom comes responsibility.  What are our responsibilities with this freedom we talk about?  We've had talk about making examples and setting proper rules.

 

[16:18] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): This is the talk I want to use to segue into our longer yearly discussion of BDSM in specifics.

 

[16:18] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So first let's talk about our freedom, how we are free to be us, and what responsibilities, if any, come with this freedom.  What does it mean to be "free" in the context of our lifestyle?

 

[16:19] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Rouge, you've been thinking about this I can tell, so you will start us off today!  Tell us how you are free!

 

[16:19] яøυɢє ѕνєиѕкα (RougeLaroux Resident): thanks vanni

freeing is one way to put it, and also, depending who you ask as to what that freedom entails.

 

the constraints of daily life can take its toll on most if not E/everyone here in one way or another. so to be able to " shed the shackles" of vanilla life, and take up those of M/s, D/s etc is soo refreshing. yes, there are those, like myself who life the M/s life 24/7, and if it wasn't for having this in my life, and having those who Own myself in this world and in real life, I can guarantee you id not be here.

 

M/s, BDSM has been a saviour for myself in more ways than one. some know my past, some dont, but suffice to say, after what I have had to endure most of my life, compared to how life is now, I wouldnt change it for the world.

 

my family, and my friends give me a great anchoring, and a way to be able to find my way back if do start to drift. thankfully I can honestly say I have that in both worlds, not many have that luxury in either.

 

[16:19] яøυɢє ѕνєиѕкα (RougeLaroux Resident):  life, this lifestyle is VERY much freeing for me#

 

[16:20] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): yes!  This is a common kind of response, and you encapsulate it perfectly!

 

[16:22] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Many of us feel shackles of having to perform in a Vanilla world and hide what we really feel inside.  It's, as we say, seen to be socially irresponsible and dubious to say we enjoy being a "slave" or liking to hit people or being hit, etc

 

[16:22] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So I think your opening salvo really hits the nail on the head.

 

[16:22] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thanks so much Rouge! ♥

 

[16:23] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Brianne, when you are ready, you can remove your gag and speak...for a while :P

 

[16:23] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): Thank you, Vanni.....

 

[16:24] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): Freedom and Liberty imply a lot of latitude, as they should, but they're not anarchy.  “your personal liberty to swing your arm ends where my nose begins”.  We talked about structure last week(?) and to me, D/s is a structure that says "inside the limits of this sandbox you may indulge your kinky desires."  That opens up possibilities, not ends them.  In other places I have different freedoms.  In D/s, I'm free to expand on some needs that are very near and dear to me.  The structure, the rules of the road, so to speak, give me degrees of freedom in that way.  I believe I'm just reforming what others here think and say.  I love being in this sandbox with you all. #

 

[16:24] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): #

 

[16:24] Arella McGregor (Arella4 Resident): chuckles @ that quote

 

[16:25] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I like how you put that

 

[16:26] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): the very rules and structures we place on our lifestyle -- SSC, RACK, safety in mind -- allow us to indulge in things that would be otherwise very harmful, and let us self-actualize.

 

[16:27] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): For those of Y.you that have been in my class for the Angel program on Wants and Needs, I talk about developmental psychologist Abraham Maslow, and show his "Hierarchy of Needs."

 

[16:27] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): the need to self actualize is the highest of the needs, but it's a real one!

 

[16:28] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Otherwise we never fully develop as humans

 

[16:28] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): so some invent great things, some win car races, some create lifesaving medicines...and some like to go to kinky clubs and do naughty things (like me)....it's each person's life to actualize!

 

[16:28] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So perfectly said Brianne!

 

[16:29] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): Thank you!

 

[16:29] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thank you!

 

[16:29] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Mistress...soon to be Mistress Adept(!) Arella...You are up please! :)

 

[16:29] Arella McGregor (Arella4 Resident): Thank you, Vanni.  It can be confusing to have "Freedom" in the same sentence with BDSM, D/s, submissive, slave, and limits. The freedom comes from the structure.  A known format of what is expected and accepted can alleviate stress and concern for such matters.  And ofc those things are tailored to each individual.  #

 

[16:30] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): It is interesting how structure can be freeing, isn't it Mistress.  Once we know the parameters of behavior, we can really be free to act.

 

[16:32] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Very well said, thank You Mistress! ♥

 

[16:32] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We go to Aspen when ready, please!

 

[16:33] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident): Thank you Vanni,

 

[16:33] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident):  dungeon where I live but the people who ran it moved. We still have the dungeon but need good people to run it\

 

[16:35] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): See, this is exactly the point.  Aspen told us about her needs and lifestyle.  "Polite society" would frown at her and tell her to stop.  Here we applaud her, and encourage her self-exploration.  THAT is freedom.

 

[16:35] Peaches Svenska (Peaches Gapchenko): Indeed!

 

[16:35]  - ד ה א ๖̶̶̶̶ۣۣۜۜζ͜͡-call me D (dontstopbelieving2006 Resident): smiles

 

[16:36] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Aspen, I love all the growth you have shown over the couple years I've known you, and I think the Aspirant path is really going to make you shine.

 

[16:36] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident): Thank you Vanni

To me it means I can relax and be me behind the keyboard. I cam express my emotions and playful self. In Real I can still be myself but on the outside people see me as a professional women working with students at school. But on the weekends I can do things like being naked in my house, Going out with no underwear on with even with anal beads in her ass. When I was in Gor for 3.5 years as a slave it was like letting go. I had some good Masters but had bad one also to where they wanted to kill me. But it was for me behind the keyboard was the freeing of letting all of the emotions that were pinned in. D/s has giving me more freedom of who I really am..

Here I can be very naughty, But as I need the structure, of protocol with a Master who knows my wants and needs and more. So being a slave/sub is a learning in progress for me. 

Living in a so called small town where I have to drive to a dungeon like 100 miles South of me and local munches 60 miles again South of me. When we had a good

[08:33] Aspen Diamond (aspenbell03):  dungeon where I live but the people who ran it moved. We still have the dungeon but need good people to run it\

 

[16:36] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli):  applauds my friend.

 

[16:36] Peaches Svenska (Peaches Gapchenko):  gave Aspen a smile and a thumbs up

 

[16:36] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thank you for that!

 

[16:36] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We move to Sir D please!

 

[16:37]  - ד ה א ๖̶̶̶̶ۣۣۜۜζ͜͡-call me D (dontstopbelieving2006 Resident): thank you

 

[16:37]  - ד ה א ๖̶̶̶̶ۣۣۜۜζ͜͡-call me D (dontstopbelieving2006 Resident): I definitely believe this can be freeing for alot of people. How that looks is going to vary depending on peoples experiences.  For me,  while ive had over 15 yrs expericing and growing within my own knowledge.  I love that there are places here on sl where we can have the freedom to meet others and explore with them.  That is a freedom I am aware that not many have.  May it be because of an unsupportive spouse or people not supportive of their own journey. There is a freedom here that gives us the opportunity to grow within that knowledge and learning the structures that exist within those spaces.

 

[16:37]  - ד ה א ๖̶̶̶̶ۣۣۜۜζ͜͡-call me D (dontstopbelieving2006 Resident): ----

 

[16:37]  - ד ה א ๖̶̶̶̶ۣۣۜۜζ͜͡-call me D (dontstopbelieving2006 Resident): A good example of this is seeing a friend of mine attend her first high protocol event.  Seeing her in subspace and so happy was one of the most beautiful things I have ever seen for her. While she had aftercare, it was beautiful to see her so calm and happy after her session.  She looked so free and blissful, for someone like her it was very rewarding for her. While I myself have never been to those events as a submissive, it does peak my switchiness (what i call it) to one day try the same.  As a switch and someone in dom head space most of the time and  gay, I believe its important in my own opinion, to continue exploring both my dominance and submission by learning from those I can and having those experiences I find to be beneficial toward my growth, including those I am with.

 

[16:37]  - ד ה א ๖̶̶̶̶ۣۣۜۜζ͜͡-call me D (dontstopbelieving2006 Resident): ---

 

[16:38]  - ד ה א ๖̶̶̶̶ۣۣۜۜζ͜͡-call me D (dontstopbelieving2006 Resident): The fact that I have the freedom to do so because of where I live and my rl situation, is a gift because not everyone is as lucky. We do not have that kind of freedom on the gay grid where alot there is not about community or education but sex and getting what you need when you need it.  Which is fine for some people but not everyone wants that. And I am glad that we have the freedom to have spaces that encourage growth through understanding and education here on Secondlife.  (done)

 

[16:38] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Yes! :)

 

[16:39] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I love everything You said there Sir.

 

[16:39]  - ד ה א ๖̶̶̶̶ۣۣۜۜζ͜͡-call me D (dontstopbelieving2006 Resident): thank you :)

 

[16:41] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Very well said and I thank You for your perspective that can be very enlightening to others that haven't had Your experiences.  We pride ourselves here in Xaara by trying to incorporate all positive experiences and outlooks.

 

[16:41] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thank You!

 

[16:41] Candice Svenska (CandiceElla Resident): agrees :)

 

[16:42] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): OK Peaches, keep the Svenska hand held high here, you're up!

 

[16:42] Peaches Svenska (Peaches Gapchenko): Thank you Vanni,

I would give my eye teeth to live the D/s life in 1st life, 24/7 but it's not feasible due to my 1st life family. Sadly, I have 2 failed marriages, each 17 yrs long, because both men handed over total control to me, even though i desperately did NOT want it.

 

I dont WANT to make all the decisions and make all the money, and make all the unpleasant phone calls and deal with ass whole people who dont do their jobs right like car repairmen, lawn people..etc. I had to wear the fricking pants and man up! I HATED it!

 

Here, I dont have to make all the decisions. Master Ballard is the only one who wears pants in our family! His decisions and the structure he provides, absolutely allow us that freedom to experience self

[16:43] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I know a lot of people in my First Life BDSM community that say much the same thing, in different ways, Peaches.

 

[16:44] Sarkie Pantera (MzSarken Resident): nods... hates those decisions

 

[16:44] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): and I've mentioned my friend that works for Starbucks, has to make decisions in her job as a manager, and then goes home to her 24/7 Master and can just "let go" and let Him make all the decisions

 

[16:44] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): it's how she recharges her batteries

 

[16:44] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So what you're saying here is 100% understandable in our community

 

[16:45] Peaches Svenska (Peaches Gapchenko): im so jealous of her!

 

[16:46] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I wonder also if the reverse is true, Peaches -- do Dominant people who are stuck in jobs where they are NOT the decision maker use the D in D/s to recharge their batteries and go back to the mundane job where they have to enact the will of others?

 

[16:48] Peaches Svenska (Peaches Gapchenko): thats also why men can be abusive i think, because they are bossed around all day and come home and take out that frustration on their wives

 

[16:49] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I agree Peaches....taking out those frustrations in a negative, abusive way

 

[16:49] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Whereas the struture of D/s would allow them to get those needs met in a positive, proactive way

 

[16:50] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Well said, thank you!

 

[16:50] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We move on to Grace, you are up please!

 

[16:50] Grace (GracieMoonheart Resident): HI , I see or feel it "freeing" in a more personal way, In rl i have many people at home i am responsible for , my Mom, my brother , my son.... so I find I have a lot of pent up feelings and issues , so in this lifestyle I can express those feeling open and honest thru a flogging or a spanking , giving me a good hard cry or a red bottom , it frees me of the tied up emotions that I am unable to express . #

 

[16:51] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Yes!

 

[16:51] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Getting those kinky needs met can allow those in the lifestyle to stabilize themselves

 

[16:52] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I had a student back in the early 2000s who had a kinky roommate.

 

 

[16:52] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): And said roommate would go to the local BDSM club to "center" by getting beaten, then she could come home and study

 

[16:53] Grace (GracieMoonheart Resident): nods it centers my focus

 

[16:53] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): She would get agitated and needed that naughty act to get her back on track

 

[16:54] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thanks Grace, well said :)

 

[16:54] Grace (GracieMoonheart Resident): thank you VAnni

 

[16:54] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We move on to Sylvie please!

 

[16:55] Sylvie Delvalle (Pureperle Anton): Thank you Vanni!

 

[16:55] Sylvie Delvalle (Pureperle Anton): For me, It is both simple and complex. Complex because before offering my submission, I had to get to know this Man! Was I able to give him what he wanted? Did he have any aspirations that would not suit a fulfilling relationship for both of us. During our conversations, I felt an immense need to kneel at his feet and give him who I am. And it's simple, because our exchanges allow me to open up to him, to share my "darkest" desires, my wildest dreams. I finally feel free!

 

[16:55] Sylvie Delvalle (Pureperle Anton): In terms of daily life, belonging to Master Lngo allows me to release stress and tension. I have rules, a framework and I know what he expects of me. He knows that I can manage my RL life and he supports me as much as I can for him... Difficult for me to express everything in a few words, but it is certain that it allows me to flourish and to give the best of myself in all areas of my life #

 

[16:56] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): :)

 

[16:56] Ballard (Ballard Svenska): q

 

[16:56] Sylvie Delvalle (Pureperle Anton): look at Master Ballard

 

[16:56] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Well said Sylvie!

 

[16:56] Ballard (Ballard Svenska): How many submissives would say that Rules make you feel more "Free"?

 

[16:56] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Please go ahead and answer

 

[16:57] Iris (Iris Blackwood): may I share an analogy I'm fond of?

 

[16:57] Ballard (Ballard Svenska): It is an often misunderstood (by dominants) factor

 

[16:57] Sarkie Pantera (MzSarken Resident): yes. not so much free as anchored

 

[16:57] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Go ahead Iris!

 

[16:57] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): oh, that's a nice way to describe it, Sarkie

 

[16:58] Sarkie Pantera (MzSarken Resident): smiles

 

[16:58] Humormii (Humormii Resident): the calm in the storm

 

[16:59] Iris (Iris Blackwood): That's exactly right, Sarkie, and leads into  my analogy actually. I see my Dominant as the planet or star even around which I orbit. In a sense, the Dominant sets my orbit through rules and expectations and then that sort of gravitational pull that keeps me in that orbit gives me the freedom to act#

 

[16:59] Ballard (Ballard Svenska): Nice

 

[16:59] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Yes, exactly Iris

 

[16:59] Sarkie Pantera (MzSarken Resident): smiles

 

[16:59] Sylvie Delvalle (Pureperle Anton): Great!! well said Iris

 

[17:00] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): A lot of s-types say they feel "unmoored" and adrift minus those rules

 

[17:00] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): I can truly visualize that, Iris.  I can feel that myself.

 

[17:00] Candice Svenska (CandiceElla Resident): nice :)

 

[17:00] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Because as Peaches said, that leads to the necessity to make the decisions they crave NOT to make.

 

[17:00] Iris (Iris Blackwood): very much so

 

[17:00] Grace (GracieMoonheart Resident): great analogy Iris

 

[17:00] Sylvie Delvalle (Pureperle Anton): easier for me to make decision if I have a framework

 

[17:00] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Right

 

[17:01] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident):  nods nods @ Sylvie

 

[17:01] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): See a Bottom doesn't need that.  They like to go to the club or wherever and get their kinky acts on, and then can go back to their life and do their "vanilla" thing minus frustration

 

[17:01] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Whereas the S-type, on a spectrum from Sub to Slave, needs more control in their life

 

[17:02] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So I think all of this discussion is hitting on that

 

[17:03] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Excellent points, thank you Sylvie, Iris and Master Ballard!

 

[17:03] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We go back to Aspen please!

 

[17:03] Sylvie Delvalle (Pureperle Anton): welcome Vanni

 

[17:03] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident): Thank you Vanni

I feel the way Grace does. If I could get a spanking, or flogging, or ect. I could have a good cry and wash all of those pin up emotions. When I get frustrated and have my melt downs Which a bunch of you have seen in me. You know that is what I need to re-focus and return to a balance emotions to where you keep walking on your path of life here and in Real feeing of freedom in both worlds.

 

[17:04] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Agreed Aspen!

 

[17:04] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident):  applauds Aspen

 

[17:05] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Well said, thank you ASpen!

 

[17:05] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Miss Petra, thank You for waiting, You are up please!

 

[17:06] Petra Steele (PetraSteele58 Resident): My comment will come from a somewhat different perspective thank you Vannie.  I think there is another source of freedom or the restriction thereof.  I am speaking of freedom within the realm of the intrapersonal, as opposed to that of the interpersonal/community.  I think that having in internal, psychological sense of freedom can come from or be restricted by such things as self concept and self esteem, the relative strength or inflation of ego., also body image which will include pathology/illness or disability, and finally one's level of overall mental health and one’s attitude or investment in the importance of material things. In other words one may live in a "free society:" but experience restrictions that will make the individual feel "unfree" or imprisoned by factors which are essentially internal.#

 

[17:06] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli):  nods a lot as Miss Petra's comment

 

[17:08] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): And it's the interplay of society's reaction to whatever we are or how we look and then the effect on one's self-esteem, which then plays back out to society.  We may be a very accomplished person, but if society has in its collective mind there is something "wrong" with us (scare quotes intentional), then that will start to weigh on us.  And that limits freedom.

 

[17:09] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): So 100% agree Miss Petra...society may be free, but that doesn't guarantee freedom to everyone, sadly.

 

[17:09] Petra Steele (PetraSteele58 Resident): just so Vanni

 

[17:10] Sarkie Pantera (MzSarken Resident): well said Vanni

 

 

[17:10] Iris (Iris Blackwood): side note sorta...there's actually an episode of SVU where an academic gets one of her students to pretend to be the writer of a D/s themed novel that she can't admit to writing herself at the risk of her career as a college professor

 

[17:11] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Obviously they don't have tenure!

 

[17:12] Iris (Iris Blackwood): lol well I think she's more concerned about being just not taken seriously than actually being fired but yes it reflects that pressure to conform we all feel in the vanilla world

 

[17:12] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I agree Iris

 

[17:12] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): That's why I'd write an academic book on all my kinky, perverse activities

 

[17:13] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Actually Master Ballard will remember I'm sure that for my Seraph path, I read and reported on a couple academic books about kink.

 

[17:13] Sarkie Pantera (MzSarken Resident): coughs, hand up,...I'll take a copy of that, please

 

[17:13] Ballard (Ballard Svenska): I recall it well

 

[17:14] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): The beauty of the Social Sciences is we can study and report on just about anything

 

[17:15] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): perverts

 

[17:15] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): BDSM is very well represented in our studies

 

[17:15] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I do lots of participant observations...for science *nods*

 

[17:15] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): yay Science!

 

[17:16] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Any other comments on today's topic?

 

[17:17] Iris (Iris Blackwood): I'm pretty sure I studied Beowulf under the only professor that could ever have made me love it so yes conversion is possible LOL

 

[17:17] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Did you read it in the original Klingon,....er...Old English?

 

[17:17] Brianne (kittenbunnydoll Resident): *laughs*

 

[17:17] Sarkie Pantera (MzSarken Resident): facepalm

 

[17:17] Iris (Iris Blackwood): bits of it were read in OE, yes, but we had a translation as the main source

 

[17:17] Ballard (Ballard Svenska): Beowulf is amazing

 

[17:17] Aspen Diamond (Aspenbell03 Resident): This has been great Vanni thank you.

 

[17:18] Peaches Svenska (Peaches Gapchenko): always is, Vanni rocks, no doubt!

 

[17:18] Vanni Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thank Y/you all for coming!