[16:40] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Good morning and
welcome to Koffee Klatch!
[16:41] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Our discussions
are in text and are in the usual C/Q/R format, meaning type "C" if
you wish to make a comment, "Q" if you have a question, usually
directed at a person's comments, and "R" if you wish to retract
either your C or your Q. If a person has
a question for a specific person on what they said, just say "Q @
[name]"
[16:41] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We tend to go in
the order received, however, we generally will promote questions directed at a
person's comment to the top. The
handy-dandy giant coffee cup in the middle will keep track of the order.
[16:41] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): If a person asks
a question of the group, there is no need to put in a "C" to reply,
replies to the question will be open.
Just answer, or we'll have a bunch of "Cs" at the bottom.
[16:42] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Please keep
further greetings and extraneous talk in IM...otherwise it gets noisy! Thank you! ♥
[16:42] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): The archive for
this Klatch can be found here:
https://xaarakoffeeklatch.blogspot.com/
It houses current and many older discussions.
[16:42] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): With that out of
the way, we'll begin.
[16:43] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I have as usual a
bit of exposition
[16:43] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): feel free to put
in a C or a Q as I ramble or after then we'll get to the queue
[16:43] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Today we talk
about something that's never popular but is important.
[16:44] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We talk a lot
about how we meet, what expectations to have in a D/s relationship as it
grows...
[16:44] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): How to maintain
it, how to keep each other happy in the D/s framework
[16:44] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): But we don't talk
much about *ending* things.
[16:44] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): It's never
pleasant and it always causes hurt.
[16:45] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): But at times it's
just necessary
[16:45] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): And I think it's
important to do this in a responsible way.
[16:46] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Every
relationship I felt I had to end from my side involved me talking directly to
the person.
[16:46] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Not a notecard,
not a "breakup" thing on Discord
[16:46] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Not even just in
IM. I feel that in such situations it's
necessary to have inworld proximity.
[16:47] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I would not break
up with a First Life person via a phone call.
[16:47] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): but this is me
and how I view things.
[16:47] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): However, the
WORST thing to do to a person is just ghost them.
[16:48] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): and I'd bet a
hamburger to each of you (or mushroom burger if vegetarian) that each of us
either have had that happen to us or known a person in SL who had it happen
[16:48] daks Ravenclaw (Dakota50 Resident): yup..
[16:49] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): In fact the reason I decided on this is I just
read an article on Apple News about how "ghosting" is a major problem
for people, especially Millennial age and below.
[16:49] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): ): So today's
questions are 1) How do we know that we have reached *that* point where it's
just breaking apart and needs to end? 2)
What can we do to mitigate the hurt, if anything? and 3) As this is D/s rather than vanilla,
how do the roles of D and s fit here?
Can a Dom just end things by fiat, or should they, and do subs have the
right to do this? (Some say not at all,
or they must ask for release).
[16:50] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Feel free to
answer any or all of those or give us your comment on anything relating to
this!
[16:50] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): RB, when ready
please
[16:53] RB (RBQuinn Resident): I have lost several wonderful
subs to RL circumstances changing, usually a RL spouse deciding SL was
verboten. But in a couple of cases, I
decided after quite a long time debating with myself, that the sub in question
and I were simply mismatched too much for the relationship to continue to be
fun and satisfying to us both. In those
two cases, I took Vanni's 'advice' and met one on one, face to face here, and
explained as best I could what my opinion was.
It was, indeed, very hard to do.#
[16:53] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): nods
[16:53] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): it is
[16:54] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): the first time I
had to do that many years ago the person freaked totally and took a month to
get back to any semblance of 'normalcy' -- but I let her say her piece as she
processed
[16:55] RB (RBQuinn Resident): nods.... I did, also.
[16:55] RB (RBQuinn Resident): I've also been ghosted and
tossed out on my ear... which is even MORE painful.....
[16:55] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Ghosting is the
worst
[16:55] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): and I've that
happen to me more times than I'd care to admit
[16:56] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): just a knife in
the heart
[16:56] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): and from people
who I TOLD I found that painful, they swore never to do it, and did it
[16:56] RB (RBQuinn Resident): ouch!
[16:56] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Anyway enough of
"Days of Vanni's Whining"
[16:56] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): RB thanks for
that comment to start us off, spot on!
[16:57] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We go to Wynter
please!
[16:57] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): I think every
situation is unique unto itself. There will never be a clear cut: "this is
the best way to end a relationship." Sure, there may be generalized ideas
of how to go about things, but one's ability to retain that knowledge when in
the thick of a break up truly depends on what is causing the break up and what
emotions that's brought up. (more)
[16:57] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): I think some
cases of knowing that a relationship has ended are more clear cut than others.
D/s relationships thrive on consent, trust and obedience. Think of them as a
three-legged stool. You break one of them, it's very likely you may run into a
situation where the relationship becomes damaged upon repair. What each
person's limit is in a relationship is going to be unique to them, but one
thing I think many may agree upon, is our tolerance for what is "acceptable"
for many is lower here. The consequences of a break up feel seemingly lessened.
(more)
[16:58] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): When it comes to
how D/s plays into all of this, at least in my eyes, revoking ones consent..
either to Dominate or submit should be reason enough to consider a relationship
done, but we have a mixture of "old school" and "new
school" values to keep in mind.#
[16:59] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): All well said!
[17:00] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): And I think just
as the virtual nature of SL leads to "hyperspeed" as we've talked
about, so it can also lead to faster breakups as you pointed out
[17:00] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): and lack of the
direct consequences that might come up with First Life breakups
[17:01] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): "I just mute
and done!" ... can't do that as easily in first life!
[17:01] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Wynter all very
good points thank you!
[17:01] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): smiles and nods.
[17:02] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Liss you are up
please!
[17:02] Liss (LissomePrey Resident): In answer to 3, yes I
have broken a relationship off as the sub, and I was right to, it had just run
its course. As an aside, with Vanessa having mentioned millennials, there is a
thread on the sl forums that seems to suggest we are mostly boomers or Gen X.
Finally a further question, what about when it is broken off but both can't
actually stay away from each other? #
[17:02] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): They become
friends with virtual benefits? ;)
[17:03] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): C @ Lily
[17:03] RB (RBQuinn Resident): BTDT :) But the boomerang relationships are hard on
each
[17:03] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): sure Wynter
[17:03] Liss (LissomePrey Resident): more should you and if
so how?
[17:04] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I've never done
that myself...when I broke up I did
maintain some decent friendships with people but never back to D/s or
romance. I can't speak for anyone else
though
[17:04] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): I imagine you're
asking about the situation of when you have shared places or friends where
you'll run into them. I've always found the best approach would be to remain
cordial and not try to stir the pot. Yes, feelings may be raw, but letting them
spill out won't serve the recently severed couple and will only make one or
both look foolish.#
[17:05] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): so creating an
alt and stirring the pot is a BAD idea then, Wynter? ;)
[17:06] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): laughs, "To each their own, but we are
our own worst devils I think."
[17:06] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): checks that one off the list....
[17:06] IronWolf (IronWolf Skydancer): Smiles at Liss'
question
[17:07] Liss (LissomePrey Resident): Actually he stopped it
because of rl commitments but whenever he is on sl we just get on too well!
[17:07] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): Apologies, I
meant to Liss.
[17:07] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): As Wynter said,
Liss, each relationship is unique
[17:07] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): and for some that
still works
[17:08] Liss (LissomePrey Resident): np, definitely enough
from me now :)
[17:08] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): it sounds like
you didn't end things due to bad feelings but to time commitments, so really it
sounds like a changed relationship than an ended one, at least to me
[17:09] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Good points and
question!
[17:09] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We move on to Mr.
Darrow!
[17:09] Vlad (VladDarrow Resident): Thank you Vanni. As a dominant, it is not easy for me to
initiate a break up- when I do it is usually because of a lack of longevity in
the bond, or something for Me is abruptly egregious. I am careful to cite facets that are failing
and why, then I look to see if failings are addressed. I have come to see I have bright lines, and
to be fair, if a girl has crossed a line she is not aware of, that is on Me for
not letting her know. Yet if a girl does
something, I find fully disheartening, I am quick to act. (more)
[17:10] Vlad (VladDarrow Resident): I have gotten less
impulsive over time, I like to offer a 48 hour cooling off period where we keep
it to ourselves to not divulge, we give each other time to reflect, sleep on it
as it were. However when a girl leaves
Me I often see it coming and I am much more civil about the parting. However, when it comes out of nowhere that
stuns me. I agree with Vanni, I have
always tried to do a breakup face to face in SL, usually handing them a NC I
have written telling them why, letting them read it, and I listen to the
'fallout'.(more)
[17:10] Vlad (VladDarrow Resident): My worst breakup in the
last year was a girl who's old Master had left SL and ghosted her on
Discord. Then after three months of
dating every day, she abruptly tells me she is in touch with the old guy on
discord, and "[He] is back in My life" "I have missed him"
Can you be My Master in SL and he in Discord.
I used my 48 hour rule, yet it was obvious she had 'left' (though she
would not admit it). I released
her. My lesson from that breakup is I
was more "in" then she was, people talk a good game, but are they
really 'committed'. Yet for Me all
relationships give grace if I can learn from hardships as much as pleasures.
#Done
[17:11] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Lots there and
all well said
[17:12] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): IMO *most*
breakups have clear signs prior, and hopefully mitigation can prevent them via
communication...it's where communication has failed that I think the breakup
has become inevitable
[17:13] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): and I like your
rule...my First Life partner and I do not ever yell at each other...if we get
upset we go for a walk first...then come back and talk rationally
[17:13] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): emotions get in
the way fast
[17:13] Vlad (VladDarrow Resident): Agreed sooo much
[17:13] Liss (LissomePrey Resident): nods
[17:14] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): It's never wise
when upset to say the first thing that comes to mind...at least in a
relationship...or to your supervisor LOL
[17:15] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): "May I tell
thee that thou art a right arsehole?"
[17:15] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): never helps
[17:15] Pilar Raynier (Pilar Raynier): snickers
[17:15] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Mr. Darrow all
well said and thank you for that!
[17:16] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Danny we come to
you please!
[17:16] Danny Choryrth-Lindsay (Charove1 Resident): thank
you Vanessa......there are lots of reasons for a Dom ending a relationship they
come from slowly dying to abrubt ends one isnt any easier than the other. when ending things like vlad said its
important to stick to the facts not emotions. emotions change like the wind but
facts are steadfast and dont like.
[17:16] Danny Choryrth-Lindsay (Charove1 Resident): when a
sub tells her dom no on something that is already agreed on then thats the end
no matter old or new school. especially if the sub only gives vague
reasons. and then wont give reasons as
to why. its a break down of already
established rules and a lack of communications.
[17:17] Danny Choryrth-Lindsay (Charove1 Resident): done
[17:17] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Good points!
[17:18] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I agree that if a
submissive says flat out "no" to something they have agreed to do
there is a big issue there. As that
person's Dominant the first question I'd ask is "what's going on
here?"
[17:19] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): If all I get back
is "I'm not doing that" then, as you said, there's no D/s connection
there.
[17:19] Danny Choryrth-Lindsay (Charove1 Resident): not just
a im not doing that but vague answers
[17:20] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I'd push more and
if they can't specify why then that's a real issue for sure
[17:21] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): One thing we have
talked about a lot here at Xaara is what we often call "porch time",
where the D and the s for a short time drop role and talk one-on-one.
[17:21] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I think a *lot*
of problems can be avoided by doing that periodically or when requested
[17:21] RB (RBQuinn Resident): A-men to that :)
[17:21] daks Ravenclaw (Dakota50 Resident): for sure
[17:22] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): then back to
being the hard-ass D after! *giggles*
[17:23] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): but some subs
feel they *can't* bring things up with their D, "it's not my place to
complain." But it's not complaint,
it's relationship.
[17:23] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): And that will
lead slowly but surely to what we're discussing here today.
[17:24] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Danny, good
points, thanks so much!
[17:24] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Back to Wynter!
[17:24] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): Another thing I
wanted to touch on, was the question around how to mitigate the hurt. There is
no way to fully mitigate the hurt, entering into a relationship with your full
heart requires one to accept that they will be hurt, either because the
relationship ended due to some incompatibility, or that one of you is no longer
part of this world. In light of that, emotional intelligence can count for a
lot in these situations. Even in my most traumatizing relationships, I found it
in my heart to tell them thank you for the good memories that they gave me. If
the relationship was all doom and gloom, it wouldn't have hurt to end it I
think. (more)
[17:25] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): And for those who
may end up in shared spaces afterwards, it's important to realize that with the
exception of true safety concerns, that being cordial will usually be your best
approach. Give yourself grace though, if you need to take time for yourself..
-take that time-... I can not stress that enough. Just because a relationship
is in Second Life vs. Real Life, doesn't make it any less impactful--especially
when it ends. (more but unrelated to the above)
[17:25] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): I want to also
comment on what Vanni said about porch time. It can be a VERY useful tool, but
everyone has to come to that state of mind on the same playing field.
Unfortunately, I've learned over time that some aren't playing by the same
rules, either because of feeling that even in that safe space they can't voice
their true opinion, or because they have desires to manipulate things to their
design. Use your best judgment to figure out if what you are hearing aligns
with the actions from that person. The old adage stands true, actions speak far
louder than words.#
[17:26] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Agreed Wynter
[17:27] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): which is why I'm
always in favor of protracted "consideration" times rather than
meeting to collaring in less time than it takes to run my dishwasher
[17:27] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): nods lots.
[17:28] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Like Steely Dan
said in one song..."You can try to run but
you can't hide from what's inside of you"....and it comes out
eventually
[17:29] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): As for shared
spaces, as I've ended things face to face and mitigated what I could, I have
found that I can share spaces with those folks, with at least courtesy shown to
each other.
[17:29] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): It's when it's
done wrong that it can lead to further antagonizing IMO
[17:29] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): but that also
assumes emotional maturity on all persons too
[17:30] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): All well said
thanks again!
[17:30] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Back to RB please
with a question...and remember y'all can answer with no C first!
[17:30] RB (RBQuinn Resident): I'm curious what this august
group think about a situation where a submissive requests release, but it is
not granted. What recourse does the sub
have then? I can't imagine myself
refusing if asked to release a sub of mine, but let's say it happens....#
[17:31] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Excellent
question
[17:31] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): please feel free
to answer, no C....and I'd like to hear from subs on this too!
[17:31] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): I honestly think
that's a move of desperation in my eyes. But I'm also uniquely biased towards
that situation as I've been in it in the distant past. If someone tells me no,
anything beyond that is criminal in my eyes if I persist.#
[17:32] Vlad (VladDarrow Resident): I am with you RB, I
would never not grant that request, but it is part of why I use the 48 rule, to
give time to sort though, discern what is best going forward.#
[17:32] Liss (LissomePrey Resident): Break the collar, stay
civil but if necessary block them (btw I've never done it or had to do it)
[17:33] Connie (Constanse Levenque): I had that one time. I
was granted a release with a demand to keep in contact.. That made things
harder in my eyes as the brake up was tough enough.
[17:34] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): nods
[17:34] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): But to Vlad's
point, if there is a rule in place.. that would be one thing. But my example
I'm using to form my answer wasn't anything of the sort, it was abuse, pure and
simple to force conformity.#
[17:34] Kahlan ღ Dark (wobbles08 Resident): But once you
broke and no longer under his collar, he really couldn’t make that demand,
could he?
[17:35] Danny Choryrth-Lindsay (Charove1 Resident): in my
opion if a sub has asked for release and it is refused then consent has already
been retarcted. as a switch i feel that it is within the subs right to run away
at that point.
[17:35] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I've never had
that happen as every sub I've had save one just ghosted me one day. Never said why, never said if they were
unhappy, just gone. The one who came and
talked to me, we are still good friends, she had a very good reason and of
course I gave her release.
[17:35] RB (RBQuinn Resident): nods to Kahlan "It seems like a breakup
that is not really a breakup"
[17:36] RB (RBQuinn Resident): I agree with Danny -- running
away is a reasonable response to denial of release
[17:36] Cedric Harcourt (Cedric Harcourt): to Kahlan's
point, the implied pressures we place on oneself to be a "good" sub
has to be reassessed at times to understand if it is truly required or no
longer personal d/s relationships
[17:37] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I think Vlad's
"let's wait 48 hours to talk and be sure this is the best course of
action" is great
[17:37] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): nods.
[17:37] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): so it's not just
an emotional reaction to something
[17:38] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): that said, if
what is happening is abuse...the sub doesn't need to even ask IMO...if it's
really abusive and not just "they're such a meanie!"
[17:39] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): but everyone is
going to be a bit different on what that line of demarcation is....
[17:40] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): any other answers
to RB's question?
[17:40] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thanks RB! Great question!
[17:40] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): We have an
anonymous comment next
[17:41] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): [09:40] Coffee
Discussion Tracker: Anonymous message: Lots of talk of mitigating hurt, but
what happens when the D or s you are breaking up with is also your spouse? Can
you keep the vanilla and find D/s with another?
[17:43] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): Ooof... that's
rough.. that'd take a LOT of emotional maturity and security in each person's
ability to communicate and (for lack of a better term) negotiate the situation.
If you weren't poly or open previously, that's a new discussion to be had and
considering you're de-escalating from a more intense relationship, that'll take
time to even broach that subject in my eyes without damaging the vanilla
relationship.#
[17:44] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I'd find it hard
to unwind the two relationships honestly
[17:44] RB (RBQuinn Resident): Indeed!!
[17:44] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): much less as
Wynter said, add a third
[17:44] Danny Choryrth-Lindsay (Charove1 Resident): are the
people in question also in a D/s relationship in RL too?
[17:44] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): nods in agreement with Vanni.
[17:44] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): No idea Danny
[17:45] Danny Choryrth-Lindsay (Charove1 Resident): if they
are then i would have to question how can a D/s relationship switch back to
vanilla while the other takes on another dominant
[17:46] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): agreed
[17:46] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): that would be
major tough to negotiate
[17:46] Vlad (VladDarrow Resident): As well if you are going
'poly' should not all 3 parties the two souses and the new D have to 'meet' to
discern, who has what power- say I am the D I want you to not ever wear
panties, as an example#
[17:46] Danny Choryrth-Lindsay (Charove1 Resident): agree
vlad
[17:47] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): "Hi dear how
was work? I'm going to Master Blaster's
tonight to get whipped and sodomized.
Dinner is on the stove!" (yes a little flippant but...)
[17:47] RB (RBQuinn Resident): grins
[17:47] Vlad (VladDarrow Resident): Hub: Oh fun honey, you
are lubed right?
[17:47] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): LOL
[17:48] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): But seriously
there is so much to unpack in such a circumstance
[17:49] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): I almost feel
that would be a nearly impossible situation to navigate truly. Because without
more information and inferring from the question, I'm assuming they still want
D/s in their life. Making the safe assumption of heteronormativity here at
Xaara, asking your former Dominant, now newly again just spouse to have the
ability to let another (presuming here) man Dominate them, would take a whole
HEAP of emotional intelligence that may be lost if not enough time has passed.#
[17:49] Vlad (VladDarrow Resident): compersion a word we
have in our vocabulary-- but OMG we all need to practice it more in poly
[17:49] Danny Choryrth-Lindsay (Charove1 Resident): im going
to be honest. if i was my spouse domiant
and she wanted to be released and switch to vanilla with me while letting
another man dominate her then i dont think that would work
[17:50] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): the person added
a second anonymous comment (which I know to share this time)
[17:50] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): [09:49] Coffee
Discussion Tracker: Anonymous message: No RL, strictly SL though much is
shared. The love is there but D/s has fizzled to more vanilla comforts. Yes,
poly, but only vanilla partners at this time
[17:51] RB (RBQuinn Resident): Thanks.. that makes the
question at least tractable, though still very difficult....
[17:51] Danny Choryrth-Lindsay (Charove1 Resident): so if
they are with their spouse and the new dominant demands she comes to them as
her spouce i would have a problem with that. as her new dominant if it told her
to come and she didnt i would also have a problem with that
[17:52] RB (RBQuinn Resident): I guess if BOTH agree the D/s
is 'gone', then poly for D/s could be discussed, but ... wow.
[17:52] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Discussed yes
[17:52] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): taken slowly
maybe
[17:52] Vlad (VladDarrow Resident): Compersion :)
[17:52] RB (RBQuinn Resident): VERY
[17:53] RB (RBQuinn Resident): Compersion is great, but this
situation stretches it to the brink of breaking, I fear
[17:53] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): That's still a
very messy situation to navigate. It all comes down to how they'd feel about
the change in that situation. It's not going to be an easy conversation in my
eyes, it will be challenging. But it would rely on the relationship you've
cultivated as to how it may end up.
[17:53] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): I agree RB,
Compersion relies on security.
[17:53] Kahlan ღ Dark (wobbles08 Resident): think
compersion would be a must, Sir Vald, So much compassion and love and empathy
would be needed
[17:54] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I don't go into
any SL relationship expecting strict monogamy, tbh. it's too easy to get around and I'd rather
talk via compersion and 'share' than
place what might easily be a false expectation
[17:54] Danny Choryrth-Lindsay (Charove1 Resident): the sub
is asking her old dominant to become a standard patner and giving control over
to another man. does her partner have
any say in what the dominant is allowed to do or ot do
[17:54] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): I would hope,
Danny!
[17:56] Danny Choryrth-Lindsay (Charove1 Resident): if i may
add something
[17:56] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): sure!
[17:56] daks Ravenclaw (Dakota50 Resident): NO Fear
[17:56] Wɣŋtɛr Sɛrɛŋaɖɛ (Wynter Serenade): That would have
to be negotiated. I know of many relationships that have a D/s poly partner and
a vanilla poly partner and the framework for that has been negotiated
extensively between all three parties. I think the important thing here is
handling the situation gracefully. Time has to take it's course to be open to
even entertaining that idea. Especially as that may have caused some hurt
pride.#
[17:57] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): agreed
[17:57] Danny Choryrth-Lindsay (Charove1 Resident): I am
both dominant and submissive. Miss is
strictly dominant. we are both poly, but
we each have needs that the other can not fill.
[17:57] Danny Choryrth-Lindsay (Charove1 Resident): i have
my submissives that are mine and Miss has hers and there is a boundary between
it
[17:58] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): right
[17:58] rayne Bowdit (rayne Bowdit): I do wonder if the sub,
while caring for their existing dominant has reached a point that they want the
D/s back, but do not want to hurt their spouse by not only asking for release
but also hoping to end the dynamic entirely..
Are they wanting to make it the other persons choice to end
everything? Deep down do they just want
to let one person go and not be the one to end it. Just a crazy subs thought
[18:04] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): that's awesome RB
!
[18:04] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): lol Cedric :P
[18:05] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): Thank you all for
being here and giving so many good points.
You truly are the August Assembly!
[18:06] Vanessa Cannoli (Vanessa Cannoli): And have a lovely
Sunday!
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